Yeah, I do think it's possible to be both as I certainly am. In my case it's just something to do with an almost solipsistic world view, although I'm not sure how true that is with everyone else.

 

Arn't Narcissists outgoing and overconfident?

 

I see what you're getting at, but I don't really think they are similar. Aren't narcicissts by definition almost the complete opposite of a person with social anxiety? They generally want to be the center of attention, are very extroverted, consider themselves superior to everyone else, etc.

 

Yeah, I think that narcissists experience anxiety when they aren't having attention paid to them, while SAers feel anxiety when people are paying them attention.

 

Yes, very nicely said, I agree.

On the other hand, both are about attention - this was said somewhere above as well. Both disorders - they are actually seeking positive attention, maybe the difference here [exept many others, of course] would be that ND would be glad to have this attention in front of many people and person with SA also, but would feel anxious, not safe, not sure, maybe not worthy and akward in the moment of being rewarded with positive feedback/attention in front of a class, or office or so.

 

Nice analogy Drella. I think one of my ex's was a narcissist. She was super confident in a group of people, but when we were alone she really freaked out about what people really thought of her, and was quite down on herself.

 

i think i am narcissistic...

I check myself out in the mirror...on good days when i think i'm Hot my ego is sky rocketed and i just feel like crap afterwards for all the negative things i might have thought about others

On bad days i just want to hide and put myself down

I find it very difficult to find a balance where I can accept myself and feel good about myself internally and externally and not have to be throwing any negativity around.

 

Wow that's exactly the way I feel, I was thinking of that the second I saw this thread. Depending on how I look I'm a COMPLETELY different person on the inside.

I have the most social anxiety when I feel like crap but I'm most narcissistic when I like what I see in the mirror.

 

I certainly hope narcissism is nothing like SAD. I don't think I'm self absorbed at all. I'd be pretty offended if someone called me narcissistic. And I also agree with Drella. Nicely articulated :yes

 

Yeah, I think that narcissists experience anxiety when they aren't having attention paid to them, while SAers feel anxiety when people are paying them attention.

Nicely said! I think that's true, in that way SAers and people with a narcissistic disorder are the complete opposite. Because, of course they're two completely different disorders. But both have to do with attention. (although I also heard it's possible to be a shy narcissist...)

Hmmmm.. this is what I found when I googled "narcissim social anxiety":

The narcissistic solution is to avoid comparison and competition altogether and to demand special treatment. The narcissist's sense of entitlement is incommensurate with the narcissist's true accomplishments. He withdraws from the rat race because he does not deem his opponents, colleagues, or peers worthy of his efforts.

As opposed to narcissists, patients with Anxiety Disorders are invested in their work and their profession. To be exact, they are over-invested. Their preoccupation with perfection is counter-productive and, ironically, renders them underachievers.

It is easy to mistake the presenting symptoms of certain anxiety disorders with pathological narcissism. Both types of patients are worried about social approbation and seek it actively. Both present a haughty or impervious facade to the world. Both are dysfunctional and weighed down by a history of personal failure on the job and in the family. But the narcissist is ego-syntonic: he is proud and happy of who he is. The anxious patient is distressed and is looking for help and a way out of his or her predicament. Hence the differential diagnosis.

 

'As opposed to narcissists, patients with Anxiety Disorders are invested in their work and their profession. To be exact, they are over-invested. Their preoccupation with perfection is counter-productive and, ironically, renders them underachievers. '

This doesn't ring true for me. I think i'm a potential perfectionist, but lack the motivation, focus and determination. Hmmmmm....

 

'As opposed to narcissists, patients with Anxiety Disorders are invested in their work and their profession. To be exact, they are over-invested. Their preoccupation with perfection is counter-productive and, ironically, renders them underachievers. '

This doesn't ring true for me. I think i'm a potential perfectionist, but lack the motivation, focus and determination. Hmmmmm....

What you said sounds like me, too.

 

Since I'd heard of narcissism before social anxiety, I used to speculate that this might be what I was suffering from.

 

Yeah, I think that narcissists experience anxiety when they aren't having attention paid to them, while SAers feel anxiety when people are paying them attention.

Nicely said! I think that's true, in that way SAers and people with a narcissistic disorder are the complete opposite. Because, of course they're two completely different disorders. But both have to do with attention. (although I also heard it's possible to be a shy narcissist...)

Hmmmm.. this is what I found when I googled "narcissim social anxiety":

The narcissistic solution is to avoid comparison and competition altogether and to demand special treatment. The narcissist's sense of entitlement is incommensurate with the narcissist's true accomplishments. He withdraws from the rat race because he does not deem his opponents, colleagues, or peers worthy of his efforts.

As opposed to narcissists, patients with Anxiety Disorders are invested in their work and their profession. To be exact, they are over-invested. Their preoccupation with perfection is counter-productive and, ironically, renders them underachievers.

It is easy to mistake the presenting symptoms of certain anxiety disorders with pathological narcissism. Both types of patients are worried about social approbation and seek it actively. Both present a haughty or impervious facade to the world. Both are dysfunctional and weighed down by a history of personal failure on the job and in the family. But the narcissist is ego-syntonic: he is proud and happy of who he is. The anxious patient is distressed and is looking for help and a way out of his or her predicament. Hence the differential diagnosis.

OT- Not to make light of this topic or anything, but how funny that you're talking about narcissists and you have a Brian Kinney avatar. :lol

Gale Harold pretty. So pretty.

*drooooooool*

 

Re: re: Thin line between Social Anxiety and Narcissism?

Since I'd heard of narcissism before social anxiety, I used to speculate that this might be what I was suffering from.

Me too.

A long time before I even knew what SA was I read something about narcissists/narcissism and recognised some of the following characteristics/symptons: Only relying on oneself, not trusting others, being paranoid, out of touch with reality, exagerrating, lying, looking down on others, envious of others, obsessed with fantasies of unlimited succes, arrogance, self-indulgent, selfdestructive. But when I looked into it more I knew I wasn't. (I can be quite narcissistic but I definitely don't have the narcisssistic personality disorder.)

OT- Not to make light of this topic or anything, but how funny that you're talking about narcissists and you have a Brian Kinney avatar. :lol

:lol Hehe yeah Brian is the epitome of narcissism! I absolutely love the character... and, gotta love Gale!

 

Sometimes I'm afraid that I don't have SA but I have Narcissism instead :hide Actually it's a huge fear of mine right now and causes me a lot of worry and stress I think a lot of the symptoms are really similar.

 

We are not attention seekers. There is no way that I could talk to anyone else in as much depth as I can with strangers on this forum. I'm the furthest thing from an attention seeker. I just have anxiety. I can't feel anxiety on this board because I am not in a physical social situation, this allows me to speak my mind however I want. I also know that the people here will understand what I'm going through.

 

i've thought about this before, and i do think i'm narcissistic in some ways.. just think about all the times we consciously avoid social situations because we think they're "stupid" and that we're above it all.. like when a group of our friends goes drinking or bar-hopping we might feel it's so idiotic and that we have better things to do.. that's certainly a narcissistic point of view..

because we're often pessimistic, we're prone to criticize everything and everyone around us ("this place sucks", "i don't like him/her") and i guess we do put ourselves on somewhat of a pedestal at times..

so yes, i agree that we share certain aspects with narcissism, but more often than not, we just appear snobbish to other people because of our fear of rejection..

 

I think I can be narcissistic sometimes....I never thought it was related to SA though. Interesting question indeed.

 

Hey, I am glad to read this discussion. I definitely think some forms of narcissism can be similar to social anxiety. But this is only my own deduction, I ve never read anything scientific about this. If anyone has some info or good source I would be thankful.

As was mentioned somewhere above, yes, I think both disorders have few traits in common: selfobservation and selfobsession, and also hypersensitivity on what others think or how do they treat those people [wanted to say us, as I am something in between or combined :teeth ]. I've read there is a hidden form of narcissism when these people are sensitive on what others think and are rather anxious in general and shy and try to please others. This could be also something very similar to some forms of SA. Hm.
For discussion...

PS: This is just great quote: Shyness has a strange element of narcissism, a belief that how we look, how we perform, is truly important to other people.
André Dubus Quotes

 

No, I don't think narcissism and social anxiety are at all the same. Narcissism is about entitlement and thinking you are above it all. SA is about insecurity and fears of inadequacy.
They are on opposite ends of the spectrum...only similar in the sense that they both involve thoughts that are out of touch with reality.

As long as we're sharing quotes, here's one I like:

“Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal.” - Albert Camus

 

Thank you for your opinion, Mikailum

Oh yes, the quote you posted I know and it is great :teeth I love that one.

I know that there are differences between SA and narcissism but still I would be curious if someone - I mean now an author of some study or someting serious - could give me some answers to this all. My interest is more focused on diagnostics in psychotherapy: maybe someone can come to a therapist claiming that he/she suffers SA and it would be only a form of ND. Who knows...It is still interesting to ponder about this stuff. :um

 

Btw, why I ever asked this question:

me personally and two of my friends suffer from SA.

All of us we are:

a) hypersensitive - this is directed to ourselves of course
b) expansively thinking about and concerning with ourselves
c) shy amongst strange, new people or in particular social situations, shy in the company of mature, intelligent, selfconfident people sometimes [let's call them perfect here]
d) kind of often thinking about the others as those who suffer lack of social IQ - the others are those ,,bad" when we are not comfortable in a social situation [mostly with ourselves ]. Usuallly we start to strong dislike those others. Why? beacuse they give us feelings that they are better, more successful, more popular, simply they threw our Ego down of the pedestal. Isn't this a bit narcissistic?

Then:
a) we cannot stand competition and concurency - no way, cannot cope with it, so it is better to avoid it

b) when we finally get some attention we are really high and forget about our theories on empathy a bit

c) we are hurt easily - when we talk about that situation where we got hurt by criticism or ingoracy etc. we are angry, agressive or insulted deeply. Usually we are hurt from simple reason: no one gave us that so much needed attention and why should it be us to start the conversation first?! We needed to learn this in therapy.

Maybe it is about anxiety and its effect on cognition and emotionality, maybe it is the lack of social skills or some part of emotional/interpersonal intelligence. Anyway, I would be curious if SA could be a form of ND, the hidden ND [i do not know the proper name for it, or the correct one, formal one].

 

I dont think that.. Thats just another way to be down on yourselfs. Its the same with everyone. Everyone has an ego.. about the same amount. Some people are pushed into a different place in life but i think everyone is egotistical.. the same amount too. If someone wasnt egotistical they wouldnt make you feel identified with something good or bad. I think we live in a world that is sick.. i say that passively.. it worships success and punishes the people who arent successful. I think thats a fact.. most people wont like to hear that but i think its the truth. I think someone that is really smart and understands about their ego doesnt make a person feel bad or push them into a bad place. They would make someone feel comfortable and not have an ego. When you are proud of yourself and above the rest you have to have the people you are above so you make them feel the identity that is bad and isnt proud but the other successful one still has an ego the same size, it just is stroked and applauded not hurt.

 

lol i used to have SA, but i think it's turned into narcissism. not sure though.

 

Haha, I feel the same about me, now am I confused: do I have any disorder or am I just going mad?

 

I'm mad