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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have always wanted to know what the difference was between cocaine, adderall and wellbutrin. I came across this post on a thread from a drug experience type website. This obviously isn't a scholarly source but does anyone know if this poster is correct?

"Adderall, is not like coke, ritalin is more like coke. Adderall and dexedrine Release stored dopamine from the neurons. LIke a waterfall flowing out of a dam. COcaine and ritalin block the reuptke of dopamine , more like blocking up the dam, or the neuron, so it allows more dopamine to be in the synapse. its complicated, but thats what i always say.

I actually did both. Ritalin , orally didnt do nothing, and i was still tired, well i took it becaue i ran out of adderall. But i snorted ritalin and the effect was 5x better, but wore off quick and i got bursts of anxiety here and there.

adderall is alot smoother, and less anxiety, and i dont think you need to snort adderall . NOw dexedrine, pure dextro-amphetamine is superior because it is like adderall, but more mental focus and less anxiety than adderall, because adderalll has those different racemic mixures. 1/4 of adderall is dexedrine, and 1/4 of adderall is an old weight loss drug bezadrine i beleive. The dex is the best effect. for focus mental clarity, and social ness, without that ephedrine shaky feeling."

From this... Read more: http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9139#ixzz1WZpe30wy

So according to this, wellbutrin IS just like cocaine (because wellbutrin blocks the reuptake). So that makes me think ALL of these medications (adderall, wellbutrin, ritalin, and dexedrine) are extremely dangerous. Cocaine and adderall are both on the "top 10 most dangerous drugs" list and wellbutrin is like cocaine and ritalin, and adderall/amphetamnies are different but obviously we know they are bad.
 

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Not too sure. I have tried both wellbutrin and adderall.

I find adderall helpful with my add. It also doesn't make me anxious, well so far it hasn't, but I'm currently on a break from work (major stressor) so we'll see how it goes when I start up again.

Wellbutrin didn't do anything for me lol. I'm finding myself curious to try it again to see if I atleast feel something this time, since it seems that most people atleast feel something from it.

I probably won't try it again for a good while cause I like the combo I'm on and don't like switching around meds. When I find something good, I stick with it lol.
 

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I know a number of people who inject their wellbutrin because they get a rush. But the results are not pretty (and I'm just talking about the tissue damage. Icky!).

Having said that, I'm no pharmacologist, but I'm pretty sure that wellbutrin has little resemblance chemically to cocaine or amphetamines (and I'm pretty sure that cocaine and amphetamines have little in common other than they're both stimulants. And by this logic, caffeine should be considered hugely dangerous).

If wellbutrin or amphetamines (or even coke, i guess, theoretically) is prescribed by a doctor who knows what they're doing and monitors the situation closely, then there shouldn't be a problem. The drugs themselves aren't all that dangerous, it's what you do with them.
 

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If wellbutrin or amphetamines (or even coke, i guess, theoretically) is prescribed by a doctor who knows what they're doing and monitors the situation closely, then there shouldn't be a problem. The drugs themselves aren't all that dangerous, it's what you do with them.
Exactly. Some people will get prescribed 30mg adderall daily, then end up doubling or tripling their prescribed dose to get that feeling good feeling. Then they have a huge "come down" from the med, experiencing anxiety, racing heart, depression, and they say the drug is dangerous and crap.
 

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I have always wanted to know what the difference was between cocaine, adderall and wellbutrin. I came across this post on a thread from a drug experience type website. This obviously isn't a scholarly source but does anyone know if this poster is correct?

"Adderall, is not like coke, ritalin is more like coke. Adderall and dexedrine Release stored dopamine from the neurons. LIke a waterfall flowing out of a dam. COcaine and ritalin block the reuptke of dopamine , more like blocking up the dam, or the neuron, so it allows more dopamine to be in the synapse. its complicated, but thats what i always say.

I actually did both. Ritalin , orally didnt do nothing, and i was still tired, well i took it becaue i ran out of adderall. But i snorted ritalin and the effect was 5x better, but wore off quick and i got bursts of anxiety here and there.

adderall is alot smoother, and less anxiety, and i dont think you need to snort adderall . NOw dexedrine, pure dextro-amphetamine is superior because it is like adderall, but more mental focus and less anxiety than adderall, because adderalll has those different racemic mixures. 1/4 of adderall is dexedrine, and 1/4 of adderall is an old weight loss drug bezadrine i beleive. The dex is the best effect. for focus mental clarity, and social ness, without that ephedrine shaky feeling."

From this... Read more: http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9139#ixzz1WZpe30wy

So according to this, wellbutrin IS just like cocaine (because wellbutrin blocks the reuptake). So that makes me think ALL of these medications (adderall, wellbutrin, ritalin, and dexedrine) are extremely dangerous. Cocaine and adderall are both on the "top 10 most dangerous drugs" list and wellbutrin is like cocaine and ritalin, and adderall/amphetamnies are different but obviously we know they are bad.
I am curious as to why you are taking ANY stimulant if you have any signs of anxiety. This is a very big mistake. As most psychiatrist only know drugs, this is what they typically do: you have this problem take drug A. Drug A causes another problem now you need drug B. This is what happened to me. I was given paxil for my anxiety but the paxil literally made me sleep half the day. So what did the great doc do? You guessed it! He put me on a stimulant as a way to counter the effects of paxil. BIG MISTAKE! My anxiety skyrocketed and I even started pulling out my own hair (trichotillomania).

With that said, there is no doubt that the drugs you are asking about do have similarities to cocaine. How similar? I am not sure as I need to look into it further. Either way, though, it is best to leave the stimulants behind. Wellbutrin is definitively a picker uper and works well for focus and concentration (similar to that of coke and caffeine) so it is possible it could be exacerbating your anxiety. Remember that cocaine was once used as an antidepressant and now people realize how harmful it truly was. Could the same thing eventually happen to antidepressants and "ADHD" drugs? I think so....
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I am curious as to why you are taking ANY stimulant if you have any signs of anxiety. This is a very big mistake. As most psychiatrist only know drugs, this is what they typically do: you have this problem take drug A. Drug A causes another problem now you need drug B. This is what happened to me. I was given paxil for my anxiety but the paxil literally made me sleep half the day. So what did the great doc do? You guessed it! He put me on a stimulant as a way to counter the effects of paxil. BIG MISTAKE! My anxiety skyrocketed and I even started pulling out my own hair (trichotillomania).

With that said, there is no doubt that the drugs you are asking about do have similarities to cocaine. How similar? I am not sure as I need to look into it further. Either way, though, it is best to leave the stimulants behind. Wellbutrin is definitively a picker uper and works well for focus and concentration (similar to that of coke and caffeine) so it is possible it could be exacerbating your anxiety. Remember that cocaine was once used as an antidepressant and now people realize how harmful it truly was. Could the same thing eventually happen to antidepressants and "ADHD" drugs? I think so....
My ADD is just as big a problem as my social anxiety and I have been on adderall for a few years and realized its danger and no longer wanted to be on stimulants... so that's why I was on wellbutrin (I don't think wellbutrin is considered a stimulant).

My point is, apparently wellbutrin and cocaine both work by inhibiting the reuptake of dopamine in the brain. So... 1. How different can they be? 2. If they are different how do we know that wellbutrin is safer?
 

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My ADD is just as big a problem as my social anxiety and I have been on adderall for a few years and realized its danger and no longer wanted to be on stimulants... so that's why I was on wellbutrin (I don't think wellbutrin is considered a stimulant).

My point is, apparently wellbutrin and cocaine both work by inhibiting the reuptake of dopamine in the brain. So... 1. How different can they be? 2. If they are different how do we know that wellbutrin is safer?
Yes you raise some good questions, and you know how I feel about antidepressants in general. Perhaps you can do some research over this, as right now I am currently researching antidepressants side effects.

As far as your ADD, have you looked into alternative methods for treatment. I do not think any stimulant is a god idea if you have any signs of being anxious. Actually, now that I think of it, some people develop anxiety disorders after chronic use of cocaine and other drugs of this nature.
 

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It's well known that psychiatrist prescribe other drugs to counter act with side effects from another drug. Which to me doesn't make any sense. I've had this done to me; it's basically trial and error and this makes me feel like a guinea pig.
 

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On this I totallly agree with you both bruno and quietboy. Who said I was a blind pill accepter? ;)

And Wellbutrin imo IS the prescription version of cocaine. Very similar in effect. Can not be good for you in the long term.
 

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Something you'll like

Serotonin May Hold Key to Hyperactivity Disorder
Much concern has been raised over prescribing Ritalin® or other stimulants to control hyperactivity disorders in children. Relatively little is known about the long-term effects of these stimulants or how they alter brain chemistry.

Now researchers at the Howard Hughes Medical Institute at Duke University have discovered that Ritalin® and other stimulants exert their paradoxical calming effects by boosting serotonin levels in the brain. Elevating serotonin appears to restore the delicate balance between the brain chemicals dopamine and serotonin and calms hyperactivity, says HHMI investigator Marc Caron at Duke University Medical Center. Caron is an author of the study published in the January 15, 1999, issue of the journal Science .

Attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) affects three to six percent of school-aged children. Symptoms include restlessness, impulsiveness, and difficulty concentrating. Stimulants commonly used to treat ADHD are so effective that "researchers haven't really taken the time to investigate how they work," says Caron.

Previous dogma, says Caron, held that the calming action of Ritalin® works through the neurotransmitter dopamine. Specifically, researchers believed that Ritalin® and other stimulants interact with the dopamine transporter protein (DAT), a housekeeper of sorts for nerve pathways. After a nerve impulse moves from one neuron to another, DAT removes residual dopamine from the synaptic cleft-the space between two neurons-and repackages it for future use.

Caron's team suspected that dopamine wasn't the only key to understanding ADHD, so they turned to mice in which they had "knocked out" the gene that codes for DAT. Since there is no DAT to "mop up" dopamine from the synaptic cleft, the brains of the mice are flooded with dopamine. The excess dopamine causes restlessness and hyperactivity, behaviors that are strikingly similar to those exhibited by children with ADHD.

When placed in a maze that normal mice negotiate in less than three minutes, the knockout mice became distracted-performing extraneous activities such as sniffing and rearing-and they failed to finish in less than five minutes. The knockout mice also seemed unable to suppress inappropriate impulses-another hallmark of ADHD.

Surprisingly, the knockout mice were still calmed by Ritalin®, Dexedrine® and other stimulants even though they lacked the protein target on which Ritalin® and Dexedrine® were thought to act. "That caused us to look for other systems that these stimulants might affect," says Caron.

To test whether the stimulants interact with dopamine through another mechanism, the researchers administered Ritalin® to the normal and knockout mice and monitored their brain levels of dopamine. Ritalin® boosted dopamine levels in the normal mice, but it did not alter dopamine levels in knockout mice. That result implied that "Ritalin® could not be acting on dopamine," says Caron.

Next, the researchers gave the knockout mice a drug that inactivates the norepinephrine transport protein. With transport disabled, norepinephrine levels increased as expected, but the boost in norepinephrine did not ameliorate the symptoms of ADHD as it should. This suggested to Caron's team that Ritalin® exerted its effects through another neurotransmitter.

They then studied whether the stimulants altered levels of the neurotransmitter serotonin. The scientists administered Prozac®-a well-known inhibitor of serotonin reuptake-to the knockout mice. After ingesting Prozac®, the knockout mice showed dramatic declines in hyperactivity.

"This suggests that rather than acting directly on dopamine, the stimulants create a calming effect by increase serotonin levels," Caron says.

"Our experiments imply that proper balance between dopamine and serotonin are key," says Raul Gainetdinov, a member of Caron's research team. "Hyperactivity may develop when the relationship between dopamine and serotonin is thrown off balance."

The brain has 15 types of receptors that bind to serotonin, and Gainetdinov is now trying to determine which specific serotonin receptors mediate the effects of Ritalin®.

The hope, says Caron, "is that we can replace Ritalin® with a very specific compound that targets a single subset of receptors." While Prozac® calmed hyperactivity in the knockout mice, Gainetdinov says that "Prozac® isn't the best, because it isn't very selective." Caron and Gainetdinov are optimistic that a new generation of compounds that interact more specifically with the serotonin system will prove to be safer and more effective for treatments for ADHD.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Btw does anyone know how you could block or even completely negate the norepinephrine effects of Wellbutrin so you only have the dopamine reuptake left?
You would still take wellbutrin even after saying that it is probably very similar to cocaine?

Thanks for the article, very interesting.

It seems like it's only talking about hyperactivity. My problem is inattentiveness.
 

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No just a theoretical question. I'm never going back on Wellbutrin. To be honest the only reason I ever took it was because orgasms feel so damn good on it. It's a major no no for people with anxiety.

Personally I think the inatentiveness and hyperactivity have the same cause. Just as anxiety and any arousal disorder has the same cause. They have in common that we are too stimulated, too active mentally, too aroused.... (the cause being too little serotonin as the study concluded)

Raising serotonin calms you down enough so you can focus on one thing instead of all of them at the same time. Regardless if that's what the teacher is saying instead of the girls three rows behind you, or what you are doing instead of that and that group of people is watching me,...
 

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It's well known that psychiatrist prescribe other drugs to counter act with side effects from another drug. Which to me doesn't make any sense. I've had this done to me; it's basically trial and error and this makes me feel like a guinea pig.
Yep! Several things happening I don't understand. Giving someone an SSRI to raise serotonin to ease anxiety. Then later adding Wellbutrin to it which basically completely negates the SSRI if the dose is high enough. (and even in a low dose)

Another one is the benzo's together with AD's. AD's raise one or more neurotransmitters, benzo's decrease them. You are giving ANTI-depressants together with PRO-depressants. You use one or the other but not both! This is borderline retarded yet it is very common practice.

I don't understand how modern psychiatry is deemed ok as it is now, because it's as you said a complete hit and miss in most cases.

And a more EXACT approach is perfectly possible, there is a lot that can be measured. Why the hell isn't it being done?!
 

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Btw does anyone know how you could block or even completely negate the norepinephrine effects of Wellbutrin so you only have the dopamine reuptake left?
NE effects go mostly from bupropion's major and long-living metabolite hydroxybupropion. Long-term administration leads to relatively high levels of the latter in comparison to bupropion itself, that's why systemic bupropion is mostly noradrenergic (and thus anxiogenic) while bupropion itself has much higher affinity (100:27) to DAT than NET.
The clue is inhibition of CYP2B6 enzyme, converting bupropion into hydroxybupropion. Curcumin and fluoxetine (norfluoxetine actually) may be of some help. Dopaminergic effects of bupropion are highly increased along with fluoxetine (both metabolism and pharmacodynamic synergy may be involved).
The other way is snorting bupropion, so it bypasses first-pass metabolism in the liver and reaches the brain unconverted.
 

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Thx broflovski. You do really snort it I see? I can only imagine the look on my moms face when she sees me snorting my meds :D
Yeah, and it works well. I took generic Bupropion SR previously, and it actually raised my anxiety, but energy lift was obvious. Snorting gives an instant and short-living pleasant rush, while long-term affect sustain and develops without additional anxiety - just energy, libido and mood-lift. And I take low-dose fluoxetine along with. Though needless to say that some cardiovascular side effects may be more prominent.
 
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