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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone know if psychiatrists can be effective in psychotherapy as clinical psychologists?

I want to be a psychotherapist using CBT to treat mainly anxiety disorders and phobias. At first, I thought about being a clinical social worker because I hear that these days most of them give therapy to the population. Problem is that they aren't trained in CBT according to The Shyness and Social Anxiety Workbook. Some do receive training in it after graduate school but why not during that time?

Anyway, I'm aware that most psychiatrists are specialized in the biomedical approach these days. But there are a few psychiatrists who are also excellent psychotherapists like Dr. Aaron Beck (the father of CBT) and Dr. David D. Burns (author of Feeling Good: the New Mood Therapy and The Feeling Good Handbook). Still, I'm afraid that if I study to become a psychiatrist then I wouldn't be as good if I was a clinical psychologist.
 

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Our intro psych prof broke it down like this -

1. Psychiatrists - MD's, residency in psychiatry. not much psychology. learn about brain. can deal with drugs etc. some get further training to be therapists (tends to be analytic therapy). they're like the gold standard - really good (and expensive).

2. PhD - psychology, educational psychology, counseling - 4 yr academic degrees. do research, grad school practicum helping in counseling center, and 1 yr internship. often not enough practical training - tend to do more research.

3. PsyD - doctor of psychology - 4 yr academic, LOTS of practicum, no research, and 1 yr internship. if they're sure they want to be a therapist.

4. Masters degrees - psych, ed psych, counseling, clinical social work (msw)
insurance companies don't want to pay for PhD's, so lots of masters candidates in network. good at counseling in life problems, not serious disorders, and not trauma. ok for family matters etc.
MSW best of these, because designed to train to work with people.
Licensed Clinical Practitioner (LCP) means they took tests.

5. Certificate programs - marriage and the family, substance abuse. 1 year program. eg someone did this, read some Jung, and called herself a Jungian analyst (!)

My favorite therapist was a MSW/LCP - she used mostly CBT.

Are you already in school, or just thinking about it at this point?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Wow thanks LostPancake! This is very informative! Sounds like the best course of action for me would be to become a Clinical Social Worker.

I'm not at school at the moment. I was attending a community college about one year ago but stopped because of the anxiety issues and excessive procrastination (which relates to it). I really do have a strong desire to treat people with anxiety disorders and major depression.
 

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Wow thanks LostPancake! This is very informative! Sounds like the best course of action for me would be to become a Clinical Social Worker.

I'm not at school at the moment. I was attending a community college about one year ago but stopped because of the anxiety issues and excessive procrastination (which relates to it). I really do have a strong desire to treat people with anxiety disorders and major depression.
No prob - I've seen you trying to help people on here a lot - you'd probably be great at this stuff. :)
 

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Does anyone know if psychiatrists can be effective in psychotherapy as clinical psychologists?

I want to be a psychotherapist using CBT to treat mainly anxiety disorders and phobias. At first, I thought about being a clinical social worker because I hear that these days most of them give therapy to the population. Problem is that they aren't trained in CBT according to The Shyness and Social Anxiety Workbook. Some do receive training in it after graduate school but why not during that time?

Anyway, I'm aware that most psychiatrists are specialized in the biomedical approach these days. But there are a few psychiatrists who are also excellent psychotherapists like Dr. Aaron Beck (the father of CBT) and Dr. David D. Burns (author of Feeling Good: the New Mood Therapy and The Feeling Good Handbook). Still, I'm afraid that if I study to become a psychiatrist then I wouldn't be as good if I was a clinical psychologist.
Hi. The fastest track to "doing therapy" is to get the MSW. (that's what I plan to do if I am ever able)

Don't worry about not being trained in CBT. It isn't really that hard to learn--I've seen your posts a lot on here and you know what you're talking about. I also read a few years ago in Martin Seligman's book Learned Optimism that it only takes a few months at the most to train anyone to know how to do CBT. It just isn't a complicated thing to learn. Really it's techniques. But that doesn't mean it's simple to help people!

If you are psychologically oriented then you've probably already read or heard that the #1 thing that leads to successfully helping people is the "therapeutic relationship"--not the theory or techniqes the therapist believes in or uses. Most claim to be eclectic in my experience. Mix of different theories.

I also believe a degree is useless without the natural talent (like empathy, understanding, being nonjudgmental, being resourceful, persistence, patience, etc.) I don't mean that in a negative way--I mean that if you already have the talent and help people anyway, getting the degree is like just a formality, you know?

My favorite theory is Self-Psychology (Heinz Kohut). When i look at a problem and what the person needs, I think of it in his tems (mirroring, twinship, idealization, narcissism, self-objects, etc.). I am far from dumb, but this theory took a looonnng time for me to learn & understand (still learning), unlike CBT. I'm only recently interested in CBT. But I see there are good things about every theory that can be helpful in different situations with different people.

To get back to your question, I would try to find out what kinds of classes and other requirements are involved in each of the graduate programs you are thinking about, and then go by what interests you the most. For example, if you don't care for medical stuff, and you won't mind having your patients/clients get their prescriptions from a nurse or psychiatrist, then you could lean more toward the PhD rather than MD. Also, the PsyD is better for learning more therapy than a PhD, but will take longer and be more expensive than a Masters, etc.

Good luck!:D
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you Pam! Your post was very insightful and informative, particularly with the duration of CBT training. I'm definitely convinced to become a Clinical Social Worker.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I think you should be a kwown and make people waff.
Wah? Oh! You mean I should be a clown and make people laugh? Lol, now that you mentioned it, my uncle had encouraged me to become a stand-up comedian and I've been known to make a lot of jokes during skype chats with other SAers. Lol, however, I could only remember making those funny pics and one or two funny posts here. I really didn't expected that others would find me funny.
 
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