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Well a few days back I had my first Adderall XR 20mg experience. At first it was weird because everything just looked better, the sky seemed bluer and the grass seemed greener. Within the first hour I was amazed. I actually felt the drive to WANT to socialize. If I had a group of friends I would have wanted to hang out. I also noticed while talking to some friends on the phone that emotions, such as laughing and enthusiasm felt natural. I didn’t have to “force” a laugh, so to speak. I loved it and conversation at that time was more enjoyable for me. I even felt hungry and had a nice lunch chatting up people around me for no reason. Now, I didn’t feel high at all or euphoric.

About two hours into the adderall, I felt like my eyes where in “tunnel vision” and I became very focused. My drive to WANT to socialize was gone. My easy to access emotions such as laughter/enthusiasm gone as well. I was stuck in focus mode.

About 5 hrs into it I went to Walmart still in Focus mode. I did notice how the adderall gives you a lil hop to your step, It was easy to hold my head up high. Wanting to socialize was dead. However I did notice that I didn’t get as mentally tired from socializing like I normally would.

16 hrs later the focus part was gone but trying to sleep was impossible. It took me 25 MG Ambien and 4 melatonin just to get 3 hrs of sleep. I couldn’t believe that only 3 hrs of sleep felt like 8 hrs. I was not tired. In fact I only got 4 hrs of the sleep on day 2 with no adderall. Finally the 3 day things became back to normal.

All in all. It does help a little for someone with SA, however there are many pieces missing to be fully therapeutic. I didn’t really feel more talkative but Socializing with people was less draining on my brain, probably because of the focus part.

At this point I feel a little discouraged. Adderall was ok but not great. I am starting to believe my problem is Introversion. I have social skills but I’m tired of feeling like I have a ticking time clock counting down before I get drained. This is what causes my SAD.

Feel Free to ask any questions about my experience that I didn’t cover.

I am starting to feel like we are ****ed and we need to learn to live like this! GRR
 

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Beautiful Mess
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My Adderall has never helped with my SA. I am glad you had an ok experience with it.
 

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An approximate description of Adderall's two therapeutic mechanisms is this: it causes dopamine and noradrenaline to be more active (serotonin only slightly). The dopamine generally makes you euphoric and enthusiastic, while noradrenaline makes you jittery and focused.

If you're taking it just as an antidepressant for SA, then you probably don't want the noradrenaline at all; take a look at this:

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00886886

Apparently, NRI drugs (atomoxetine, reboxetine) block some of the effects of MDMA (ecstasy), which is very similar to Adderall. I'd bet the effects it blocks are those of focus and anxiety. In the least, you might want to follow the research about adding NRIs to Adderall.

Personally, I'd much prefer pramipexole for this purpose.
 

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Some of you people amaze me with your wealth of knowledge on meds. Is there another med that would help me more than Adderall? Is Adderall top notch? I have tried Vyvanese and all the other stimulants. I just feel like one of you smartie pants knows a med that I could benefit from. :)
 

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MAOIs. They should increase dopamine and noradrenaline, like Adderall, but also serotonin. Would be a much more "balanced" treatment for ADHD in my opinion. A newer one called moclobemide has very minimal side-effects.

Also, I think a combination of pramipexole (used for RLS and Parkinson's) with amisulpride would be sustainably brilliant (better than Adderall). Just go to the doc and say you can't stop moving your legs and it's disrupting sleep; bam, you have pramipexole.

Other than those, you might consider adding pregabalin (Lyrica) to your stack, to reduce anxiety from all those stimulants.
 

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MAOIs. They should increase dopamine and noradrenaline, like Adderall, but also serotonin. Would be a much more "balanced" treatment for ADHD in my opinion. A newer one called moclobemide has very minimal side-effects.
As relatively selective MAO-A inhibitor Moclobemide has weak action on dopamine, it mainly works on serotonin and norepinephrine. If you increase the dosage too high and also strongly inhibit MAO-B you would have to follow dietary restrictions.

Also, I think a combination of pramipexole (used for RLS and Parkinson's) with amisulpride would be sustainably brilliant (better than Adderall). Just go to the doc and say you can't stop moving your legs and it's disrupting sleep; bam, you have pramipexole.
The combination of low dose amisulpride and pramipexole could easily get the dopamine levels too high with all it's potential dangerous consequences (eg. acute psychosis).
 

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Moclobemide has weak action on dopamine, it mainly works on serotonin and norepinephrine.
I thought MAO-A breaks down monoamines equally, and MAO-B is specific to dopamine and trace amines (moclobemide also has lesser effect on MAO-B). By that info, moclobemide would have slightly higher effect on dopamine than serotonin and [nor]epinephrine, but wouldn't affect PEA too much which can be somewhat anxiogenic like with selegiline 5mg.

The combination of low dose amisulpride and pramipexole could easily get the dopamine levels too high with all it's potential dangerous consquences (eg. acute psychosis).
I suppose it is a risk, but you would have amisulpride on hand to use at 100mg+ if it happened.
 

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I thought MAO-A breaks down monoamines equally, and MAO-B is specific to dopamine and trace amines (moclobemide also has lesser effect on MAO-B). By that info, moclobemide would have slightly higher effect on dopamine than serotonin and [nor]epinephrine, but wouldn't affect PEA too much which can be somewhat anxiogenic like with selegiline 5mg.
Moclobemide mainly inhibits MAO-A. To (strongly) increase dopamine levels it would also have to inhibit MAO-B (about 90%+) - but it doesn't at normal doses. Proof? There are no dietary restrictions! At normal doses enough MAO-B is left to degrade dopamine.

I suppose it is a risk, but you would have amisulpride on hand to use at 100mg+ if it happened.
Right! ;)
 

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Well a few days back I had my first Adderall XR 20mg experience. At first it was weird because everything just looked better, the sky seemed bluer and the grass seemed greener. Within the first hour I was amazed. I actually felt the drive to WANT to socialize. If I had a group of friends I would have wanted to hang out. I also noticed while talking to some friends on the phone that emotions, such as laughing and enthusiasm felt natural. I didn't have to "force" a laugh, so to speak. I loved it and conversation at that time was more enjoyable for me. I even felt hungry and had a nice lunch chatting up people around me for no reason. Now, I didn't feel high at all or euphoric.

About two hours into the adderall, I felt like my eyes where in "tunnel vision" and I became very focused. My drive to WANT to socialize was gone. My easy to access emotions such as laughter/enthusiasm gone as well. I was stuck in focus mode.

About 5 hrs into it I went to Walmart still in Focus mode. I did notice how the adderall gives you a lil hop to your step, It was easy to hold my head up high. Wanting to socialize was dead. However I did notice that I didn't get as mentally tired from socializing like I normally would.

16 hrs later the focus part was gone but trying to sleep was impossible. It took me 25 MG Ambien and 4 melatonin just to get 3 hrs of sleep. I couldn't believe that only 3 hrs of sleep felt like 8 hrs. I was not tired. In fact I only got 4 hrs of the sleep on day 2 with no adderall. Finally the 3 day things became back to normal.

All in all. It does help a little for someone with SA, however there are many pieces missing to be fully therapeutic. I didn't really feel more talkative but Socializing with people was less draining on my brain, probably because of the focus part.

At this point I feel a little discouraged. Adderall was ok but not great. I am starting to believe my problem is Introversion. I have social skills but I'm tired of feeling like I have a ticking time clock counting down before I get drained. This is what causes my SAD.

Feel Free to ask any questions about my experience that I didn't cover.

I am starting to feel like we are ****ed and we need to learn to live like this! GRR
Sounds similar to what I've experienced, also with 20mg of Adderall XR, except that my ability to socialize has lasted a little longer, like anywhere from 4 to 6 hours.

What I've been doing is I've been using those hours to do things and go places that I've never been able to before. May not be the best way to go about "exposure therapy", but for someone with severe SA, it'll have to do for now, especially since everything else I've tried (SSRI's, benzos) has failed dismally in helping my SA.
 

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An approximate description of Adderall's two therapeutic mechanisms is this: it causes dopamine and noradrenaline to be more active (serotonin only slightly). The dopamine generally makes you euphoric and enthusiastic, while noradrenaline makes you jittery and focused.

If you're taking it just as an antidepressant for SA, then you probably don't want the noradrenaline at all; take a look at this:

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00886886

Apparently, NRI drugs (atomoxetine, reboxetine) block some of the effects of MDMA (ecstasy), which is very similar to Adderall. I'd bet the effects it blocks are those of focus and anxiety. In the least, you might want to follow the research about adding NRIs to Adderall.

Personally, I'd much prefer pramipexole for this purpose.
Adding an NRI to a psychostimulant may not only tailor the effects to be more suited for social phobia, but from what I gather from the link you referenced could also greatly reduce the cardiotoxicity from long-term use of them. I wonder if the confidence-boosting, increased sociability, and willingness to face feared situations would be diminished at all though due to the inhibition of norepinephrine release. If not, do you think it's possible that pramipexole or other dopamine agonists could provide all the benefts for social phobia that CNS stimulants do? Seems too good to be true, since it's not a controlled substance and thus would be much easier to get prescribed than a Schedule II amphetamine.

I thought MAO-A breaks down monoamines equally, and MAO-B is specific to dopamine and trace amines (moclobemide also has lesser effect on MAO-B). By that info, moclobemide would have slightly higher effect on dopamine than serotonin and [nor]epinephrine, but wouldn't affect PEA too much which can be somewhat anxiogenic like with selegiline 5mg.
I've been taking Nardil for two weeks now, and if anything it's been more anxiolytic. That must mean that the increased serotonin from unselective MAOIs counters the anxiety from epinephrine, norepinephrine, and PEA becoming more active - but in that case moclobemide should also share this effect.
 

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If not, do you think it's possible that pramipexole or other dopamine agonists could provide all the benefts for social phobia that CNS stimulants do? Seems too good to be true, since it's not a controlled substance and thus would be much easier to get prescribed than a Schedule II amphetamine.
No. Complete different mechanism of action and if this really worked, drug companies, drug abusers, the DEA and psychiatrists would have known this many many years before some guys on the internet at the year 2009... ;)

I've been taking Nardil for two weeks now, and if anything it's been more anxiolytic. That must mean that the increased serotonin from unselective MAOIs counters the anxiety from epinephrine, norepinephrine, and PEA becoming more active - but in that case moclobemide should also share this effect.
PEA is degraded by MAO-B, but at normal doses (where no dietary restrictions have to be followed) Moclobemide does not sufficiently inhibit MAO-B to significantly increase PEA levels. Nardil' metabolite phenylethylidenehydrazine is a GABA transaminase inhibitor and therefor increases brain GABA levels, which could be responsible for the anxiolysis you feel now.
 

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No. Complete different mechanism of action and if this really worked drug abusers, the DEA and psychiatrists would have known this many many years before some guys on the internet at the year 2009... ;)
It does work; I think it's only recently becoming more popular as it's pretty obscure. "Rocknroll714" said he tried a similar DA agonist and it was mildly euphoric plus "great for SA"; "possibly on par with opiates in terms of anxiolysis".

If you look at this article, it describes how D2 agonists cause an increase in D2 receptors, not the usual down-regulation we'd expect:

http://oldwww.iosh.gov.tw/data/f16/shp16_1_1.pdf

Patent for pramipexole in cocaine dependency:

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6750235.html
 

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Well, no studies exist for any dopamine agonist for SA as far as I know, not even the pretty useless uncontrolled ones. Drug companies show no interest, invest no money in that area.
 

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Jrock your Adderall experience is the exact same as it is for me. The tunnel vision thing for getting stuff done is pretty wicked huh?

When I added an SSRI to the mix it changed everything. All those positive social feelings you felt, they were with me around the clock instead of just temporary and they were much more intense. The difference in social anxiety mood improvement to say that it was fantastic is an understatement.

Adderall by itself made me more antisocial.
 

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PEA is degraded by MAO-B, but at normal doses (where no dietary restrictions have to be followed) Moclobemide does not sufficiently inhibit MAO-B to significantly increase PEA levels. Nardil' metabolite phenylethylidenehydrazine is a GABA transaminase inhibitor and therefor increases brain GABA levels, which could be responsible for the anxiolysis you feel now.
So do you think Parnate would be anxiogenic since it's a non-hydrazine unselective MAOI? Or would the serotonergic action balance things out?
 

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It's not anxiogenic, just less anxiolytic than Nardil, but Nardil has much more side effects. Parnate + Klonopin is great for SA, then you have enough GABA too.
 

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When I added an SSRI to the mix it changed everything. All those positive social feelings you felt, they were with me around the clock. The difference in social anxiety mood improvement to say that it was fantastic is an understatement.
Which SSRI did you add to the mix if you don't mind my asking?
 

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Jrock your Adderall experience is the exact same as it is for me. To a T. The tunnel vision thing for getting stuff done is pretty wicked huh?
Yea man it definitely was weird. I walked outside and all of a sudden I felt my eyes "zero in" on specific points rather then pan my surroundings like I naturally do.

I can see where some people say it increases there anxiety. To a certain extent it make me feel a little jittery and restless (like a red bull does, but Addy is more extreme), However it gave me the energy I needed to channel that anxiety out-wards with people. Hence, getting more positive feedback to keep going. After awhile it became tiresome because there was no "off" button. Not moving my body definitely made me feel more anxious. As long as I kept moving, burning that excess energy I was cool.

The Addy was OK but it's missing many elements to help with socializing.
 

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especially since everything else I've tried (SSRI's, benzos) has failed dismally in helping my SA.
I believe all SSRI's and benzo's do is make me more comfortable doing nothing about the problem rather then fixing what got me there to begin with......
 
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