The Toxic Shame thread (the cause of SA for most) - Page 30 - Social Anxiety Forum
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #581 of 634 (permalink) Old 05-21-2016, 03:03 AM
Permanently Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Texas
Gender: Male
Age: 23
Posts: 1,142
This is bollocks. Absolute bollocks.

Just another one of those "gurus" trying to con the gullible mass out of money.
Beast And The Harlot is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #582 of 634 (permalink) Old 06-20-2016, 06:52 PM
stickler for paperwork
 
pied vert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Gender: Female
Age: 25
Posts: 1,043
actually I am a piece of crap, thanks!
pied vert is offline  
post #583 of 634 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 08:52 AM
SAS Member
 
TheWarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Brazil
Gender: Male
Posts: 133
My Mood: Psychedelic
First, you may find language mistakes, I'm not a native english speaker, but I'll try my best to write correctly.


Hello everyone. Good day.
My first post here, and I hope I can keep posting here to write down some thoughts, learnings and experiences.

Yesterday I reached a "dead end", felt my ground falling, felt no hope and no way out. It was a love delusion, a girl I thought I could have something with, she just said she was with another guy, and even worse things (how she wanted to have sex with him).
But she told it to a group of people and I just watched, it was not personal, it was my addicted mind who interpreted things as "the end of the world". I call it addicted because I just realised how my mind is addicted to feeling bad, to keep the good moments just as hope for a distant future that never comes. It feels safe on the negativity.

After hours of feeling sick, crying like a baby, I received some support from online friends. And I also realised how wrong it is the way my mind see things.
I realised that, after all things I've gone through, all these years facing this inner demons. Being punched on my face, having life putting me on the ground and kicking me. I'm still here, standing.
There's no way I can be weak and unworthy, many would let themselves fall to suicide or addictions. Though I've thought about killing myself, and had addictions in the past too, but I always win those temptations for self alienation.
There's no way I'm less than anyone, for many wouldn't be strong enough to resist it.

I've got a true proof of my value. I've got a unquestionable evidence of my strenght.
My last night was of being sure about it, I talked to people without feeling any kind of difference between them and me. I've open myself to people. I talked about some of the burdens I carry. And I was helped, people didn't attacked me as my old mind would fear.

But as I said, negativity acts like an addiction. I've woke up in middle of the night, feeling something strong.
My heart was beating fast, I was trembling like feeling a great fear. I felt that old thoughts trying to come back. It was my brain trying to go back to what it thinks is more safe. Feeling bad about myself was the core for my instinct of self preservation to work at it full potential.
My brain thinks that those negative thoughts are necessary for keeping itself safe. That's a sort of addiction, your brain calls for it.
And those intense sensations in the body was the way it found to try making me go back to the old way. Just like it makes your body react for not having used drugs or any other addictions. Your body try making you feel bad for not having it, so you'll go back to that addiction, because your body is used to those substances/thoughts/behaviors, and it will feel bad without having them anymore.

My most recent addiction was heavy pornography, and the symptons for being away of it are very similar. Images of it comes to the mind, you body make you feel as if you need it. But your rational mind knows it's not true. That it's not good for you. The urge is strong, you struggle inside, but we have to be strong, and not bow our heads for it.

Although my past was not easy, I have much of those "wounded inner child" symptons. But now, whenever I feel these bad feelings, I talk to this "inner kid" and I tell him about how strong we are, that we've survived much challenges, we've faced terrible times. I tell him that he's strong, and that I'm there to comfort him, not judge. But taking care means cheering up, means encouraging, making that kid feels that it's worthy and can do things. My parents never did, they were absent and I learned very little about life.
But I'm not here to blame anything. Now I know of my strenght, and I'll fight against this addiction for feeling bad. Against this addiction of fear and shame. I have nothing to be ashamed of.


Thanks for this oportunity to write my thoughts and feelings here. Hope it brings some light for you all.
We're facing the worst challenges, it's not something you go out there and solves. It's something inside us, it's the hardest challenge. And we are very strong for having dealing with it for so much time.
We are worthy for it. Say "enough!" to this feelings of inferiority. If people out there are facing "real" problems, we are facing the WORST problem.
Because someone can be poor but still trust in him/herself. Someone can be skinny, fat, ugly, and still know about it's value. But the demon inside ourselves will tell you bad things, no matter how you look, no matter what are your talents, no matter if you're smart or really good doing something. This demon is an addicted for bad thoughts about ourselves. We must be aware of our strenght and value, and so we can confront it.
TheWarrior is offline  
 
post #584 of 634 (permalink) Old 09-12-2016, 12:33 PM
Human repellent
 
springbreeze1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Land of Oz
Gender: Male
Age: 45
Posts: 623
My Mood: Lonely
I'm feeling quite anxious sitting in my isolated cubicle at work. This is actually quite the normality for me, I can work myself up to high level of anxiety even when I'm home alone. It comes with physical pain: headache, uncomfortable stomach, forceful breathing, heart palpitations...

It sucks but I'm used to it.
springbreeze1 is offline  
post #585 of 634 (permalink) Old 09-21-2016, 09:32 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasad View Post
In other news, John Bradshaw has died... (May 8th) R.I.P

He died on May 8.

I was trying to figure out how old his daughter is so I googled his name and the news came up. I feel very sad. Was actually daydreaming of being in one of his workshops the other day... Feels like I knew him personally considering that I've been researching a lot on toxic shame and his work... I do believe that he was right... Time will tell. RIP to a great person.

First of all, I want to point out that SAS has not sent me any notices in regards to posts made to this thread. This has happened on several occasions in the past and I do not know if I am the only one that has had this problem of not receiving notices of posts made to a thread we are subscribed to. That is the reason I haven't made any comments of the posts on this thread during the past few months. It's hard to do so when you don't even know a post has been made.

It just happened to cross my mind today to check in on this thread to see if any posts might have been made, and, lo and behold, I see a few have been made since my last visit. I guess I can't depend on SAS to send me notices of any posts and thus I will just have to manually check in from time to time.

Anyways, back to the subject at hand. Rasad, I thank you very much for posting the news about John Bradshaw. I had no idea he died until I came across your post today! I am very saddened to find out this great man has died. You described my feelings PERFECTLY when you said in you post: "It feels like I knew him personally considering that I've been researching a lot on toxic shame and his work". That is precisely how I feel. I would not have found out about toxic shame had it not been for John Bradshaw. And obviously finding out about the condition of "toxic shame" is the starting point to begin the healing. So, basically, had it not been for John Bradshaw, I - and countless others - would still be caught in the evil grip of toxic shame. As I've mentioned in this thread, thankfully I am now free of my toxic shame. It doesn't mean my life is perfect (nobody's life is perfect), but it does mean I no longer have the deep-down belief that I am "worthless" and "sub-human" and "less than everyone else". I no longer live in fear of talking to people. I no longer blush. The teachings of other people such as Dr. Robert Glover, etc, have certainly helped in my healing, but John Bradshaw is where learning about toxic shame all started for me. And by the way, for those of you that have been following this thread, you know I've had the same quote from John Bradshaw at the very bottom of all my posts ever since I started this thread several years ago. It hasn't changed. It goes to show how much I believe in the words of John Bradshaw.

So, yes, it definitely feels as if a friend has died. For those of us that have read his books, watched his videos, listened to his audios... we've felt as if he were talking about us - in fact - TO us. We just can't help but to feel as if we have lost a true friend that understood the pain we've had and understood the basic cause of our pain.

Now, I would like to say to John Bradshaw of what I never had the chance to say to him before. Whether or not he can read this from the Great Beyond, I don't know; but I'll give it a shot anyway:

Mr. Bradshaw, the work you produced (your books, audios, videos) was - and still is - the most important I have EVER found. You and Dr. Robert Glover are the 2 people that have helped me the most. However, the fact is that you originated the term "toxic shame" and you wrote about it first, and that is the reason I say your work has been the most important to me. Mr. Bradshaw, I can't thank you enough for your contribution in healing my toxic shame, as well as healing MANY other people's toxic shame. I will never forget.

Sir, for one final time, I bow down and I salute you!



Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #586 of 634 (permalink) Old 09-22-2016, 04:13 PM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 81
My Mood: Cool
Thank you lifetimer for creating this thread.

I have S.A.D. and it all started in a time where I was being shamed a lot by my father. I was a "black sheep" and his way of getting me in order was by being perfectionistic, militaristic, loveless, ritualistic etc. I only lived with him so I was kind of deprived of love for 2 years. My mental health problems started there, including social anxiety, and later after i left his house i became an alcoholic because alcohol was the only thing that made me feel ok.

I agree that toxic shame is the main element in social anxiety, and if i didn't have it, i wouldn´t be socially anxious, but i'm not against other methods of recovery like Cognitive Behavioural Therapy etc.

Just knowing about toxic shame didn't cure S.A.D. I've been attending Adult Children of Alcoholics which is a group that mainly deals with toxic shame, and grief and all these and I still haven't overcome my S.A.D . But i continue to "peel the onion" and share my feelings with other people and i agree seeing that other people accept you even knowing all that you are is excellent to overcome the shame.

Cognitive: Everytime you get a negative thought, cut it down with a rational statement and you'll break the cycle down fast till it has no power over you and shrinks...

Behavioural: get out, stay out, join groups, clubs, teams, plays, etc... "however you feel, get up, dress up and show up" People are nicer than you think, rediscover this and stay active and go to as many social activities as you can... this is the essence of confidence..
elmandelafoto is offline  
post #587 of 634 (permalink) Old 10-12-2016, 06:50 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 7
My Mood: Lurking
I'm sick and tired of being so super-sensitive I feel other peoples vibes more than myself without ever interacting with any of them. Despite having its benefits, the negative side seems to outweigh it. Not to mention constantly having to ask other people to not play music too loudly whereever because it starts impacting on my health and lasts for hours after things getting quiet.. don't get me even started on stereotypes imposed on people like me... or that my most constructive(ish) interests conflict with my health needs.
At least I can openly admit this creates a great feeling of inferiority because I'm not blessed with strength, quick mind or anything else either. I'm just a piece of useless filth living a meaningless life.
Raykou is offline  
post #588 of 634 (permalink) Old 10-12-2016, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raykou View Post
I'm sick and tired of being so super-sensitive I feel other peoples vibes more than myself without ever interacting with any of them. Despite having its benefits, the negative side seems to outweigh it. Not to mention constantly having to ask other people to not play music too loudly whereever because it starts impacting on my health and lasts for hours after things getting quiet.. don't get me even started on stereotypes imposed on people like me... or that my most constructive(ish) interests conflict with my health needs.
At least I can openly admit this creates a great feeling of inferiority because I'm not blessed with strength, quick mind or anything else either. I'm just a piece of useless filth living a meaningless life.
Raykou,

If you have thoroughly looked into the issue of toxic shame and you think you may have the condition, then I suggest you begin following my Toxic Shame Healing Plan. But in regards to your super-sensitivity to everything - including sound - then I don't know how much (if any) of that is related to toxic shame. I won't totally rule out that toxic shame could play some sort of part, but it would be wise to have a professional give you advice about your super-sensitivity.


Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #589 of 634 (permalink) Old 10-12-2016, 03:30 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
In several of my posts in this thread, I've been practically begging the administrators to make this thread into a Sticky. My argument has always been that this thread is THE most important thread of the entire forum. So, today I just happened to look at the main "Frustration" page and oh my gosh, they have indeed FINALLY made it a sticky! (however, I don't know how long it has been a Sticky; I just happened to check the main page and I saw it there listed as a "Sticky").

However, to be honest, I'm not sure what to think about it. Don't get me wrong; I like that they've finally made this thread into a Sticky. It's just that I'm not sure this section of the forum (the "Frustration" section) is the proper area to put my thread as a Sticky. This thread was originally in the "Coping With Anxiety" section (except it was a regular thread over there and not a sticky). They have now moved it to this section of the forum titled "Frustration". My thread isn't about "frustration" but instead it is about showing to everyone what causes the majority of cases of social anxiety (and is the cause of other psychological issues as well). AND, this thread is about providing a solution to heal one's toxic shame and thus his/her social anxiety. Thus, I don't think it should be in the "Frustration" section. The other threads that attempt to help with social anxiety (such as the thread titled "Anxiety Techniques" and "The Social Anxiety Survival Kit", etc) are in the "Coping With Anxiety" section. I figure if the administrators of this forum classify my thread to be best suited for the "Frustration" section, then shouldn't those other threads ALSO be here in the "Frustration" section?

But, now having said all the above, maybe, in the end, this will be the best spot for my thread after all. I looked at the forum table of contents page (or whatever it is called -- here is the link: http://www.socialanxietysupport.com/forum/ ) and the current stats show that the "Frustration" section has approx. 86,000 Threads & 1.2 million Posts ... versus approx. 59,000 Threads & 750,000 Posts of the "Coping With Anxiety" section. In fact, the "Frustration" section has more threads and more posts than any other section of the forum! So, statistically at least, I can reach more people here than anywhere else on this forum. It just feels a bit odd having my thread now in the "Frustration" section after being in the "Coping With Anxiety" section since this thread's creation back in 2011. But, as I said, statistically, this thread should be able to reach more people here at this section versus any other section.

To whomever made the decision to make this thread into a Sticky, I want to thank you for FINALLY making it easier for people to access this thread! Now, the responsibility is placed upon the readers of this thread to follow its advice and to follow the Toxic Shame Healing Plan I have laid out.


Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #590 of 634 (permalink) Old 10-12-2016, 03:37 PM
blurry dystopia gif ☣️
 
Persephone The Dread's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: I've come to burn your kingdom down one ****post at a time
Language: Eng (UK,) 下手な日本語
Posts: 37,745
I don't think many people who actually knew me and understood how my mind works, would argue that I'm not defective.

The wretched world we’re living in at present was not an unlucky war of fate; it was an economic and political decision made without consulting the enormous human population that it would most drastically affect. If we would have it otherwise, if we’d prefer a future that we can call home, then we must stop supporting — even passively — this ravenous, insatiable conservative agenda before it devours us with our kids as a dessert. - Alan Moore

Persephone The Dread is offline  
post #591 of 634 (permalink) Old 10-17-2016, 05:42 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 7
My Mood: Lurking
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifetimer View Post
Raykou,

If you have thoroughly looked into the issue of toxic shame and you think you may have the condition, then I suggest you begin following my Toxic Shame Healing Plan. But in regards to your super-sensitivity to everything - including sound - then I don't know how much (if any) of that is related to toxic shame. I won't totally rule out that toxic shame could play some sort of part, but it would be wise to have a professional give you advice about your super-sensitivity.


Lifetimer
That sensitivity has been pointed out by neuropsychiatrists, but also been a reason to neglect my humane reactions to other parent's domineering behavior back in childhood home, that's why I suspect it may exist deep within causing even worse SA and also that's why it's even more difficult to accept as a part of myself. That's also why I'm aiming to follow the healing plan and see if it helps.
Raykou is offline  
post #592 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-05-2016, 01:21 PM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 318
Hey Lifetimer,

great thread and information you gave to us. I appreciate your work.
I discovered I have toxic shame a few months ago, knowing that social anxiety is not the core problem and just a symptom. How long did it take for you to heal your toxic shame? Or to ask differently: How long do you think it might take to heal toxic shame with your healing plan? Of course in case you do everything on a daily basis.

I already bought all of these books and downloaded the other things (the ebook and articles). I am planning to start tomorrow by first reading the book from John Bradshaw Healing the Shame That Binds You.
NewHabits is offline  
post #593 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-05-2016, 11:35 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabits View Post
Hey Lifetimer,

great thread and information you gave to us. I appreciate your work.
I discovered I have toxic shame a few months ago, knowing that social anxiety is not the core problem and just a symptom. How long did it take for you to heal your toxic shame? Or to ask differently: How long do you think it might take to heal toxic shame with your healing plan? Of course in case you do everything on a daily basis.

I already bought all of these books and downloaded the other things (the ebook and articles). I am planning to start tomorrow by first reading the book from John Bradshaw Healing the Shame That Binds You.
Hi NewHabits,

I am very excited and glad to see you have chosen to take action to begin healing your toxic shame (and its symptom of SA). Surprisingly - and sadly - only a small number of people that have looked at this thread have taken any action whatsoever to heal their shame. The vast majority of people don't even try to heal their shame & SA but instead just continue complaining about their SA as they go from thread to thread here at the forum. This is really tragic to me. But, as I said, I am very happy you have chosen to take action to do something about your shame and SA!

Now, in regards to the time it takes to heal one's toxic shame: I believe the time it takes to heal toxic shame is up to the individual. I think the problem with people that read my thread is that they don't want to do the work and they especially seem to not want to stick with it long enough. Most people have had toxic shame and SA for most of their life, but they don't realize, that because of that reason (of having it all their life), that it will take a lot of time before they can greatly get better. They expect to get better in a few days or 2 - 3 weeks, but it doesn't work that way. This is because they need to change the person who they are, and in a way, to become another person. THAT is why it takes a lot of time!

How much time? As with any type of healing, it depends on the person. It also depends on how much work the person puts in each day (such as the repetition of studying, as well as the other healing steps to take, which also includes practicing interacting with others). It really is a gradual process in which you slowly feel yourself getting better and better. So, be sure to understand that healing toxic shame is a process involving time – it’s not an overnight thing. We’ve been living with toxic shame/SA for years, and that’s why it won’t be magically erased in a day. I am being sincere when I say that I really can't say for sure how long it will take for each individual to heal their shame and therefore I really do hate to give a timetable for how long it will take to heal one's shame. And, the reason is because there can be SO many factors for each individual that can affect how long it takes for a person to heal their shame. Things such as:

1. How severe is that person's toxic shame?
2. How dedicated is that person to healing his / her shame?
3. How much time & work & effort will that person put into heal their shame?
4. Will that person make an absolute commitment to put in the work to heal their shame?
5. And finally, just as with any other physical or psychological ailment, each person is different and we heal at a different pace.

But, having said all the above, I will go against my better judgment and offer an estimate of the time it could take. I would estimate that the entire process of healing one’s toxic shame and SA could be anywhere between 1 – 3 years. Again, I must stress the 5 elements I mentioned above in regards to the actual time it takes for a person to heal his or her toxic shame! ALSO, as I mention in detail in one of the paragraphs below, there is no exact instant that you say "Wow, I've just now healed my toxic shame!". It happens very gradually. That is yet another reason why it is so hard for me to pinpoint an exact time it takes to heal your shame. And also one more thing: each person may have a different definition from another person of when they consider themself to be "completely healed". And this is yet another reason why it is hard for me to give an specific time of when a person will heal his or her toxic shame. Because, the fact is we are not all carbon copies of each other.

In the above paragraph I mentioned that I estimate that it could take from 1 - 3 years to heal. After reading that statement, you may have said to yourself: "Are you telling me it could possibly take 3 YEARS?!". And my answer to you would be: SO WHAT if it takes 3 years? The fact is that you are going to be somewhere 3 years from now anyways (barring you get hit by a truck or some other major disaster). Thus, isn't it better for you to spend that time healing your TS? Just think back to what you were doing 3 years ago. Didn't that time fly by? I'm sure there is someone out there that feels the time has gone by slow, but I'm willing to bet that most people understand - as I do - how fast time flies by. So, don't live in regret 1, 2, or 3 years from now wishing you had began taking action "way back then" to heal your shame & SA. Believe me, it is worth it to spend whatever amount of time it takes to rid yourself of the soul-murdering condition of toxic shame.

As for myself, it's kind of a long story in regards to how long it took me to improve significantly. About the same time I found out I had toxic shame, I was working on an online business for a year & a half and I was distracted by that (however, the business failed). Also, during that same time, I was laid off from my job and was out of work for about the same time period. Since my workplace was where I was around people the most, this meant I didn't have many opportunities to practice my healing around people for that year & a half time period (because I had no job anymore). And this slowed down my healing. I would guess I spent about 80% of that time period working on my online business and 20% of that time studying about toxic shame. So, periodically during that year & a half time period, I DID at least have some time to study and read about toxic shame and what to do about it -- such as those steps I've talked about in post #152 of my thread. But, still, at some point we need to have human contact to help us get better.

Eventually, I found a job and began to put into practice around my co-workers the things I learned. I would say at that point it took about 3 months to make a nice amount of improvement. Keep in mind that I had put in a fair amount of studying for over a year before I was able to begin to practice what I learned (because I was out of work for so long). I know I said I only spent about 20% of the time studying about toxic shame and reading books about it over that year & a half time period, but that still adds up to a fair amount of time... considering it was a year and a half. Anyway, those first 3 months practicing what I learned with my co-workers & receiving their mirroring eyes was just the beginning. I gradually improved from that point on. As I said earlier, it really is a process – a very gradual process. As you begin to heal from your toxic shame, the lines can become a bit blurred as you gradually go from having toxic shame - to that of healing your toxic shame. At that point you will begin to wonder if you are 100% toxic shame free, or if any uncomfort level you are now feeling is that of lacking confidence in your social skills and life experience (lacking social skills and life experience is, I believe, common with toxic shame people). IF it is just a case of lacking confidence and feeling uncomfortable in these areas, then that has nothing to do with still having toxic shame. You can be 100% free of your toxic shame but still lack confidence in these areas. Getting rid of toxic shame doesn’t mean you will be confident in those areas of your life that you have very little experience in. Of course the way to gain confidence with your social skills is to of course practice being social around people. I do think that as your toxic shame begins to heal, then it becomes easier to be social around others. That is how it worked out for me.

I mentioned earlier that when I first began to study about toxic shame, I was sidetracked with an online business for about a year and a half, but I still spent about 20% of that time reading books about toxic shame and learning what I could about it. After that year and a half “distraction period” was over, I would guess beginning at that point it took me anywhere between 1 year to a year & a half in order to very significantly (if not completely) improve from my TS. Again, it was all a very gradual process, so it really is hard to pin-point an exact specific time in which I gotten better. I’m not saying I’m absolutely perfect – because I feel I can always improve even more and get even stronger in various areas of my life (I think that applies to everyone, regardless if a person has TS or not) - but what I am saying is that SA & toxic shame are no longer issues with me.

NewHabits, I hope I have answered your questions. Or, if nothing else, reading my long post will make it easy for you to fall asleep. LOL.


Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #594 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-11-2016, 09:44 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Germany
Gender: Male
Posts: 221
Hello Lifetimer,


first thank you for putting all this information together and sharing your journey with us.
I found your thread 5 years ago and we wrote a bit then.
Well 5 years later i havent done your healing plan. Mainly because im depressed and have no purpose in life. Im now 28 years old and have no job, no education and no real friends and on top of that no hope.

Im depressed and cant motivate myself to do things that are uncomfortable. I try to but i have a hard time sticking to it for a long period of time and trusting that ist all working out at the end.
Do you think your plan can still work for someone like me who is depressed and have nearly Zero energy to do much?
In the past ive tried a lot. Doing 2 hour EFT sessions everyday to heal my past Traumas, listening to thinkrightnow everyday, meditate one hour everyday, running, Fitness...
but i was in my early twenties then and i was trying to get an education had atleast a job. Through the daily torture of hopelessness and overwhelming anxiety, I was determend to overcome my Problem and did everything i could. Now my belief that i can cure my Problem which is avoidant personality disorder has diminished by facing "reality".

Also it would be cool to see you on YouTube to see how free you are. That may motivate more people to follow your advice.
I can sense People by looking at them and i can feel their energy behind. You say you are healed, which is a very courageous statement to make and hard to believe for many of us.

DO IT NOW. SOMETIMES "LATER" BECOMES "NEVER"
tobi08 is offline  
post #595 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-12-2016, 03:55 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
Quote:
Originally Posted by tobi08 View Post
Hello Lifetimer,


first thank you for putting all this information together and sharing your journey with us.
I found your thread 5 years ago and we wrote a bit then.
Well 5 years later i havent done your healing plan. Mainly because im depressed and have no purpose in life. Im now 28 years old and have no job, no education and no real friends and on top of that no hope.

Im depressed and cant motivate myself to do things that are uncomfortable. I try to but i have a hard time sticking to it for a long period of time and trusting that ist all working out at the end.
Do you think your plan can still work for someone like me who is depressed and have nearly Zero energy to do much?
In the past ive tried a lot. Doing 2 hour EFT sessions everyday to heal my past Traumas, listening to thinkrightnow everyday, meditate one hour everyday, running, Fitness...
but i was in my early twenties then and i was trying to get an education had at least a job. Through the daily torture of hopelessness and overwhelming anxiety, I was determend to overcome my Problem and did everything i could. Now my belief that i can cure my Problem which is avoidant personality disorder has diminished by facing "reality".

Also it would be cool to see you on YouTube to see how free you are. That may motivate more people to follow your advice.
I can sense People by looking at them and i can feel their energy behind. You say you are healed, which is a very courageous statement to make and hard to believe for many of us.

Hi Tobi, it's good to hear from you again. I will state right off the top that yes I do believe healing your toxic shame (with my plan as a good method) will help you with those problems you've mentioned. And the reason I believe this is because as Gershen Kaufman, the author of the book titled "Shame", says: "Shame is the affect which is the source of many complex and disturbing inner states: depression, alienation, self-doubt, isolation, loneliness, paranoid and schizoid phenomena, compulsive disorders, splitting of the self, perfectionism, a deep sense of inferiority, inadequacy or failure, the so-called borderline conditions and disorders of narcissism." I do believe (and have always believed) avoidant personality is one of the issues related to toxic shame. Therefore, with the knowledge we now have of toxic shame, common sense tells us that the effects of toxic shame can easily play a part in a person being depressed, not having any motivation, not having any real energy, having a feeling of hopelessness and other such symptoms. If a person has toxic shame and, as a result, has a feeling of being flawed, defective, unworthy, not as good as other humans, etc, then it is easy to understand how toxic shame can play a big part with those specific issues you've mentioned. Thus, how can a person be motivated, high energy and optimistic when he (or she) has a feeling of being defective and unworthy and soul-less? As the now late, great John Bradshaw said: "Toxic shame is a soul-murdering condition". Therefore, is it any wonder you have those issues you've mentioned?

However, I want to make it clear that I am not saying toxic shame causes every case of depression and lack of motivation and lack of energy. Obviously it is possible that some other issue (such as a physical / medical issue) can cause one or more of those things. It is up to each person to look at himself / herself and use their best judgment - using all available information - to conclude the most likely cause of their problem.

I will say again that if you believe TS is still an issue in your life, then you MUST do the work to heal yourself of this terrible condition. I do believe you will then find that those issues you've mentioned will melt away, once your TS is healed. It doesn't mean your life will be perfect and you will never have another problem. The fact is, life IS problems. There is always a challenge, obstacle or roadblock for us to overcome. But if you have toxic shame, it is very difficult to live a happy and productive life. This is why I believe it is so important for you - and anyone else with TS - to follow the TS Healing Plan and heal your shame. Take the plan seriously and do the work. You can heal.

In regards to me making videos on YouTube, your idea is a good idea. However, I am a very private person when it comes to giving very specific details about myself or putting videos of myself on the internet. Even with the few times on this thread in which I've given specific details of my life, I was really hesitant to do so. I don't mind at all talking in person to people that are open to conversation about it (I've already done this in some of the meetings I've mentioned in this thread), but I have to admit that I do fear if people who know me (such as family, friends, etc) were to see me in a video or knew it was me that has made this thread, then I do have a fear they would automatically think I am "weird" and "crazy". Yes, I do think YouTube videos of myself would be helpful to others to help deal with their with toxic shame, but I feel I can still help others without creating any videos of myself ... without creating a situation of people close to me finding the videos and thinking the wrong things about me. I have a lot of admiration for all the people that put out YouTube videos of themselves detailing various problems and issues they have had in their life. I've always wondered how they could do that and not fear that their family and friends would discover their videos on YouTube and have awkward feelings around them afterwards. I still won't totally rule out making videos on YouTube in the future about what specifically caused my toxic shame and the role it has played throughout my life, and of course the healing methods I followed, but for now I just do not feel comfortable putting all my very personal information out on the internet.


Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #596 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-13-2016, 10:59 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Germany
Gender: Male
Posts: 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifetimer View Post
Hi Tobi, it's good to hear from you again. I will state right off the top that yes I do believe healing your toxic shame (with my plan as a good method) will help you with those problems you've mentioned. And the reason I believe this is because as Gershen Kaufman, the author of the book titled "Shame", says: "Shame is the affect which is the source of many complex and disturbing inner states: depression, alienation, self-doubt, isolation, loneliness, paranoid and schizoid phenomena, compulsive disorders, splitting of the self, perfectionism, a deep sense of inferiority, inadequacy or failure, the so-called borderline conditions and disorders of narcissism." I do believe (and have always believed) avoidant personality is one of the issues related to toxic shame. Therefore, with the knowledge we now have of toxic shame, common sense tells us that the effects of toxic shame can easily play a part in a person being depressed, not having any motivation, not having any real energy, having a feeling of hopelessness and other such symptoms. If a person has toxic shame and, as a result, has a feeling of being flawed, defective, unworthy, not as good as other humans, etc, then it is easy to understand how toxic shame can play a big part with those specific issues you've mentioned. Thus, how can a person be motivated, high energy and optimistic when he (or she) has a feeling of being defective and unworthy and soul-less? As the now late, great John Bradshaw said: "Toxic shame is a soul-murdering condition". Therefore, is it any wonder you have those issues you've mentioned?

However, I want to make it clear that I am not saying toxic shame causes every case of depression and lack of motivation and lack of energy. Obviously it is possible that some other issue (such as a physical / medical issue) can cause one or more of those things. It is up to each person to look at himself / herself and use their best judgment - using all available information - to conclude the most likely cause of their problem.

I will say again that if you believe TS is still an issue in your life, then you MUST do the work to heal yourself of this terrible condition. I do believe you will then find that those issues you've mentioned will melt away, once your TS is healed. It doesn't mean your life will be perfect and you will never have another problem. The fact is, life IS problems. There is always a challenge, obstacle or roadblock for us to overcome. But if you have toxic shame, it is very difficult to live a happy and productive life. This is why I believe it is so important for you - and anyone else with TS - to follow the TS Healing Plan and heal your shame. Take the plan seriously and do the work. You can heal.

In regards to me making videos on YouTube, your idea is a good idea. However, I am a very private person when it comes to giving very specific details about myself or putting videos of myself on the internet. Even with the few times on this thread in which I've given specific details of my life, I was really hesitant to do so. I don't mind at all talking in person to people that are open to conversation about it (I've already done this in some of the meetings I've mentioned in this thread), but I have to admit that I do fear if people who know me (such as family, friends, etc) were to see me in a video or knew it was me that has made this thread, then I do have a fear they would automatically think I am "weird" and "crazy". Yes, I do think YouTube videos of myself would be helpful to others to help deal with their with toxic shame, but I feel I can still help others without creating any videos of myself ... without creating a situation of people close to me finding the videos and thinking the wrong things about me. I have a lot of admiration for all the people that put out YouTube videos of themselves detailing various problems and issues they have had in their life. I've always wondered how they could do that and not fear that their family and friends would discover their videos on YouTube and have awkward feelings around them afterwards. I still won't totally rule out making videos on YouTube in the future about what specifically caused my toxic shame and the role it has played throughout my life, and of course the healing methods I followed, but for now I just do not feel comfortable putting all my very personal information out on the internet.


Lifetimer

Hi Lifetimer,


just thank you for all your supporting and encouraging messages. You are cool.
I know i want to heal, and i know TS is my main problem .The way of healing is different for anyone i guess. I for example would work with the book "Heal Yourself: a journey to find you" by Janet Greene. It teaches the Greene Release technique and the Reader will gradually learn to use it and implent it into their life by healing past Trauma. And gradually allowing oneself to feel, beginning with positive Feelings like smelling a flower, sunlight etc.
However so far i havent healed anything. With healed i mean i remember that situation where i was ridiculed or laughed at and i dont feel negative emotions anymore, and therefore dont have the negative beliefs like "i have no right to exist".


Im not sure if i follow your plan exactly. I found the advice DR Glover gives is just typical personal growth stuff which i cant hear anymore because its too hard to do for someone with avoidant personality disorder. Telling myself to be confident allday or act so never did work in the long run. Bradshaw hits the Point with his books, but i remember feeling very depressed and alone and hopeless after reading it, cause i felt me and everyone in the world is so ****ed up. I focus on the inner work for now, and get some Support from the outside like a Support Group.
Just want to say anyone on their own way.

DO IT NOW. SOMETIMES "LATER" BECOMES "NEVER"
tobi08 is offline  
post #597 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-13-2016, 10:52 PM Thread Starter
SAS Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Gender: Male
Posts: 614
Quote:
Originally Posted by tobi08 View Post
Im not sure if i follow your plan exactly. I found the advice DR Glover gives is just typical personal growth stuff which i cant hear anymore because its too hard to do for someone with avoidant personality disorder. Telling myself to be confident allday or act so never did work in the long run. Bradshaw hits the Point with his books, but i remember feeling very depressed and alone and hopeless after reading it, cause i felt me and everyone in the world is so ****ed up. I focus on the inner work for now, and get some Support from the outside like a Support Group.
Just want to say anyone on their own way.

I want to make something clear so people won't get the wrong idea about my plan and also so people won't get the wrong idea about what Dr. Glover teaches. And what I want to say is that Dr. Glover does not teach for people to tell themselves to be "confident all day". In other words, he doesn't specifically teach positive thinking as the key to improving yourself. Yes, part of what he teaches has to do with the mental aspect of a person, but he doesn't teach "positive thinking". Actually, the biggest part of what he teaches is to take action, and he explains in detail of various ways to take action in accordance to what he teaches. My plan uses a lot of ideas from Dr. Glover, but I also incorporate ideas from other experts into my plan as well. So, anyways, my point is neither my plan nor Dr. Glover teaches positive thinking as a way to get better. I (and Dr. Glover as well) teach others to work on the important mental & emotional healing of oneself AND the "taking action" part that it takes to heal. As I said, I just don't want anyone to get the wrong idea that my plan (or Dr. Glover's teachings) is about positive thinking. It really isn't about that. Instead, it is about working on the mental & emotional part of you and then taking specific action steps to complete your healing. Both are needed to heal oneself.

Tobi, I really do hope the book you've mentioned in your post will help you. Everyone has to do what they feel is best for himself (or herself). If it doesn't work for you then please consider giving my plan a serious try.


Lifetimer

"Shyness can be a serious problem when it is rooted in toxic shame." - John Bradshaw, toxic shame expert

Visit this thread link to find out the cause of SA for most of us and what to do about it: http://bit.ly/UeWprg
Lifetimer is offline  
post #598 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-24-2016, 11:27 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 7
It was a worth of a time wasn't it mate?
Drivigo is offline  
post #599 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-24-2016, 11:54 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 318
I am currently reading No More Mr Nice Guy from Dr. Robert Glover.
NewHabits is offline  
post #600 of 634 (permalink) Old 11-29-2016, 11:19 AM
SAS Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: USA
Gender: Male
Posts: 496
I have toxic shame.
Peaceislove is offline  
Reply




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Toxic Shame - the core of our social anxiety TX boy Coping With Social Anxiety 100 05-21-2015 08:42 PM
Toxic friends jazzyvandal Frustration 8 04-26-2013 01:04 PM
Tv is toxic for us Lostsoul26 Coping With Social Anxiety 88 10-30-2012 01:07 PM
Toxic Relatives greyden Coping With Social Anxiety 1 11-27-2007 01:12 PM
Toxic friends jazzyvandal Coping With Social Anxiety 7 12-31-1969 07:00 PM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome