How to embrace the loner life? - Page 2 - Social Anxiety Forum
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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 11:54 PM
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For me, it's been age. If I've never felt a real connection with anyone at the ripe old age of 27, safe to say I should just accept the loneliness. I like observing human relationships though, so dive into shows and stories and other people's lives like a voyeur of sorts. I love biographies and blogs.

I come to realize that if I died and a funeral were held, I don't think the attendees would even be mourning me as a person they knew.
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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 01:42 PM
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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 02:10 PM
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I think you have to like yourself in order to be able to like other people. It's kind of like, hey, look how great I am! Let me tell you about me! Me, me, me, me! That's why people like being around other people. Sometimes, anyway.
I'd say it's more that if you don't like yourself, then you can't present yourself in a likeable way to other people. If you don't like yourself, then your voice, body language, etc. will give away this vibe: "I don't have anything of value to offer to you" - and that puts people off.

Loving yourself is important, and it must be unconditional love for it to truly stick: "I love and accept myself for what I am". It is different from narcissism, where you only care about yourself and see everyone else as merely a resource for achieving your personal goals.
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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 09:38 PM Thread Starter
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I think you have to like yourself in order to be able to like other people. It's kind of like, hey, look how great I am! Let me tell you about me! Me, me, me, me! That's why people like being around other people. Sometimes, anyway.
I'd say it's more that if you don't like yourself, then you can't present yourself in a likeable way to other people. If you don't like yourself, then your voice, body language, etc. will give away this vibe: "I don't have anything of value to offer to you" - and that puts people off.

Loving yourself is important, and it must be unconditional love for it to truly stick: "I love and accept myself for what I am". It is different from narcissism, where you only care about yourself and see everyone else as merely a resource for achieving your personal goals.
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 09:42 PM Thread Starter
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This isnt me throwing in the towel because of crippling anxiety...but because im okay socially, im not intimidated by people anymore, i can make people laugh ect... But

Despite all this... I havent been able to form long lasting genuine connections. Those Ive opened up to were just shady 2 faced peole...and no one really invites me out so... Idk wth is going on..but i dont want to worry about it a second longer..


So... How do i embrace the loner lifestyle and embrace solitude?
It doesn't sound like you want to live a solitary life - and I can relate to that, it would be horrible. It sounds like you've met the wrong people.

Maybe take a break from people for a while and recharge your batteries - then get back out there and try again. Hope you meet some nicer people soon anyway.
I mean i try and try. I make people laugh i invite them out but folks don't want to be around me..so i cant force them

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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 11:45 PM
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Loving yourself is important, and it must be unconditional love for it to truly stick: "I love and accept myself for what I am". It is different from narcissism, where you only care about yourself and see everyone else as merely a resource for achieving your personal goals.
The problem is there is no clear blueprint for unconditional self love. People dont know what that is or how to do it. So they adopt narcissism as a subs because that is what is all around. It's easy to emulate.
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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 11:55 PM
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To be honest. you can't. I can't. I've tried and failed. All it got me was zero friend, except my one best friend and over the years, my isolation is getting to that. Its healthy to want social needs if you feel that you are lacking in it. We are social beings, even if it means we need to be left alone like, 80-85% of the time. It doesn't take away our needs. The best thing to do is to acknowledge it and work on what you know to be social.yes, anxiety sucks Satan's anus, but you do what you gotta, even if it's uphill. Sometimes people are more forgiving than you might give credit for. My two cents. And if they arent, well screw them, that's on them really.
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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 01:52 AM Thread Starter
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To be honest. you can't. I can't. I've tried and failed. All it got me was zero friend, except my one best friend and over the years, my isolation is getting to that. Its healthy to want social needs if you feel that you are lacking in it. We are social beings, even if it means we need to be left alone like, 80-85% of the time. It doesn't take away our needs. The best thing to do is to acknowledge it and work on what you know to be social.yes, anxiety sucks Satan's anus, but you do what you gotta, even if it's uphill. Sometimes people are more forgiving than you might give credit for. My two cents. And if they arent, well screw them, that's on them really.
I get what youre saying. Social interaction is important but idk how to have friendships on a deep level where they call you guys hang out...

I do everything from being approachable to approaching and inviting people out and nothing happens. Idk what to do at this point.

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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 02:07 AM
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The problem is there is no clear blueprint for unconditional self love. People dont know what that is or how to do it. So they adopt narcissism as a subs because that is what is all around. It's easy to emulate.
I don't think a blueprint is needed. It is pretty simple: everyone knows what love is, and loving oneself is not much different from loving someone else. The only thing that prevents us from it is all the negative social conditioning telling us that we are not worthy of such noble feelings - but that conditioning is relatively easy to override, as long as one really wants it.

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I get what youre saying. Social interaction is important but idk how to have friendships on a deep level where they call you guys hang out...

I do everything from being approachable to approaching and inviting people out and nothing happens. Idk what to do at this point.
Why do you think that people calling you to hang out means your friendship is on a deep level? We have regular office events, for example, when some of my officemates group up and go do something fun - but that hardly means that we are all good and deep friends. I would call us, at best, somewhat close acquaintances.

If your goal is to just be invited somewhere, then that's relatively easy: you ask people you know if they are going somewhere and tag along, and after a few times they get used to the idea of you being one of them and always invite you along.

But if you want to form deep connections with people, then that's an entirely different matter. For that, you must find someone you are comfortable around, someone you can open up completely and who is willing to open up to you. Such people don't just walk around everywhere, and it takes time to find even one person like that.
I have only one person (beside my parents) in my life to whom I am close enough that I can tell them absolutely anything about myself and expect understanding and acceptance. Some people, even very outgoing people, have none. You can't really force these things.

From my perspective, it is easy for us, less social, people to see those more social as having a lot of meaningful and deep relationships - but, in truth, what they mostly have is quantity, not quality. They have a ton of superficial connections with others, but even they are lucky if they have more than 1-2 really-really deep friends who will always have their back.

To me, what really defines a close friend is not who calls you to invite you to the dinner with their other 5 friends. To me, it is someone who, when everything in your life is falling apart, will extend their hand and go out of their way to help you. Someone may have 1000 "friends", but how many of them will go and sit with them in a hospital for a whole weekend if they get into a nasty car accident? Such people are hard to come by.
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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
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I don't think a blueprint is needed. It is pretty simple: everyone knows what love is, and loving oneself is not much different from loving someone else. The only thing that prevents us from it is all the negative social conditioning telling us that we are not worthy of such noble feelings - but that conditioning is relatively easy to override, as long as one really wants it.



Why do you think that people calling you to hang out means your friendship is on a deep level? We have regular office events, for example, when some of my officemates group up and go do something fun - but that hardly means that we are all good and deep friends. I would call us, at best, somewhat close acquaintances.

If your goal is to just be invited somewhere, then that's relatively easy: you ask people you know if they are going somewhere and tag along, and after a few times they get used to the idea of you being one of them and always invite you along.

But if you want to form deep connections with people, then that's an entirely different matter. For that, you must find someone you are comfortable around, someone you can open up completely and who is willing to open up to you. Such people don't just walk around everywhere, and it takes time to find even one person like that.
I have only one person (beside my parents) in my life to whom I am close enough that I can tell them absolutely anything about myself and expect understanding and acceptance. Some people, even very outgoing people, have none. You can't really force these things.

From my perspective, it is easy for us, less social, people to see those more social as having a lot of meaningful and deep relationships - but, in truth, what they mostly have is quantity, not quality. They have a ton of superficial connections with others, but even they are lucky if they have more than 1-2 really-really deep friends who will always have their back.

To me, what really defines a close friend is not who calls you to invite you to the dinner with their other 5 friends. To me, it is someone who, when everything in your life is falling apart, will extend their hand and go out of their way to help you. Someone may have 1000 "friends", but how many of them will go and sit with them in a hospital for a whole weekend if they get into a nasty car accident? Such people are hard to come by.
I'm responding to the 2nd half of your post. Usually when people hang out with you consistently, not a one time thing they like your company and presence. Someone youre not into you wont spend time with..if you love someone and love being around them you'll spend time with them...and in my experience getting invited out is hard. People would go back on their word, forget or just not want to do it. That's okay its just a bit demoralizing I think and kinda makes you want to stop trying when you've tried so hard already and just makes you think what's wrong with you.

But also agree with what you said at the very end, true friends offer a listening ear during bad times, they help emotionally even financially if they have it in bad times and if youre hospitalized they'll be there...however it isn't either or. Good friends do both, make it known they love to be with and around you by spending time with you and are there for you when tragedy strikes...

that's my definition of a good friend.

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post #31 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 01:27 PM
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I don't think a blueprint is needed. It is pretty simple: everyone knows what love is, and loving oneself is not much different from loving someone else. The only thing that prevents us from it is all the negative social conditioning telling us that we are not worthy of such noble feelings - but that conditioning is relatively easy to override, as long as one really wants it.
Not really or else more people would be doing it rather than turning into validation seeking narcissists.
To be honest, I'm not entirely convinced that a person can love themselves in a truly meaningful way and still function well in society.
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post #32 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 01:36 PM
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I'm not entirely convinced that a person can love themselves in a truly meaningful way and still function well in society.
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post #33 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 02:12 PM
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I don't think a blueprint is needed. It is pretty simple: everyone knows what love is, and loving oneself is not much different from loving someone else. The only thing that prevents us from it is all the negative social conditioning telling us that we are not worthy of such noble feelings - but that conditioning is relatively easy to override, as long as one really wants it.
I agree that unconditional self-love is extremely important. And that it's not the same as what most people (colloquially) call narcissism, which is just an unhealthy form of conditional self-love. But I disagree that the "conditioning is relatively easy to override".

I've been telling people on here about unconditional self-love for a long time; I've worked extensively with one person for years, two others to a much lesser extent, and talked to several other people about it. I have discovered that not everyone does "know what love is".

When you ask people to try to imagine unconditional love, they can't do it without imposing conditions of one sort or another. Everyone has their own understanding of what love is, and, so far as I can tell, it's based largely on their earliest formative experiences (perhaps in the mother-child bond). If a person cannot conceive of a form of love which is not tainted by conditions, they cannot override their conditioning. At least not entirely. With a bit of work, they can undo certain specific conditions, which can help, but it's a gradual process that takes time. Years and years.

These early formative experiences can be extremely difficult to override. You have to help a person create, from scratch, an understanding of what unconditional love means so that they can start applying it to themselves. The amount of work involved varies from person to person, depending on how early they started hating themselves, and how much they have to hate about themselves, based on whatever conditional model they have of what makes a worthwhile person. For them, unconditional self-love is a mere hypothesis, and a pie in the sky one at that.

You added the condition: "as long as one really wants it", but those are the people who don't have the blueprint you say nobody needs. Anyone who does want unconditional self-love is already well on the way to having it; their path is straight, their burden is light. But the ones who don't aren't being willfully obtuse or stubborn. Their model of the world simply makes your viewpoint impossible.

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post #34 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 02:37 PM
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i'm listening.
Society does not operate on the notion of self love. In fact, it absolutely depends on people being motivated by feelings of deficiency and fear.
Trying absolutely everything to prove their worth and fear that they will not survive are the two main things that get people out of bed.
I'm sure that the person who really loves himself would be stoic loner. People would probably find that person boring. What can they really get from him and what would he need from them?
To sum up: unconditional self love does not mix well with modern society.
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post #35 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 02:39 PM
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I'm kind of ambivalent about myself.

Nobody loves me but my dog, and I think he might be jivin', too.
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post #36 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 02:56 PM
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I live a pretty solitary life at the moment - and I have no interest in changing it. I'd say it's different for me though because it was very different in the past. When I was young I had a group of mates that I was close to. I also have my wife and my son to talk to. I'm usually quite happy just doing what I want on my own a lot of the time now though - except for seeing them every weekend.

At the moment I'm just happy dealing with my changing moods and daily life. I talk to my wife every day at least once and that's enough for now.
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post #37 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-23-2019, 09:07 AM
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To embrace the loner life to any meaningful extent you have to get very little out of socializing. That doesn't mean you don't like people necessairily. Maybe people just don't get you, you can't talk to them, you don't have much in common, so while you have nothing against them there really isn't much point being around them.

Your desire to be around people will shrink and then your interest in other things hopefully grows. It's the interests that are the true embrace of a loner lifestyle. Whether that means researching topics, watching movies, creating something, whatever, doesn't matter what it is, as long as you get that buzz while you're in the zone.
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post #38 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-23-2019, 08:30 PM
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Society does not operate on the notion of self love. In fact, it absolutely depends on people being motivated by feelings of deficiency and fear.
Trying absolutely everything to prove their worth and fear that they will not survive are the two main things that get people out of bed.
I'm sure that the person who really loves himself would be stoic loner. People would probably find that person boring. What can they really get from him and what would he need from them?
To sum up: unconditional self love does not mix well with modern society.
I like this comment. Modern norms of socialization are based almost entirely on eliciting unworthiness in comparison to other people. The modern fashion and fitness industries, for example, are built entirely on this concept.

"Be different."/"Be better." Than what? Other people, implying you need to go through the comparison exercise and question your self-worth and who you are.

Self love, for me, has meant truly focusing on being better than I was yesterday, not better than person XYZ. That's a constant battle and not something I have reconciled though. You can certainly learn from others on how to improve yourself, but it's a fine line with letting that learning become what you compare against for improvement. I can look up to Arnold S in his prime for improving my physique, but my body will obviously have different fitness limits/looks.
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post #39 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-24-2019, 05:23 AM
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Self love, for me, has meant truly focusing on being better than I was yesterday, not better than person XYZ
that's basically what self-love is. it's not about being better than other people, wtf?

self-love is accepting yourself thru and thru and cultivating cherishing your personality, to the point where you can go into the world and spread good vibes and be a caring person for the people you meet in your lifetime.

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post #40 of 43 (permalink) Old 05-25-2019, 02:12 PM
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I've been wondering how to do this too. I don't really know what I truly want because if I stay in solitude long enough, I become comfortable in it.....but the moment I talk to another person and do something social, I feel the need for friendship and socializing. All of that comfort in solitude goes away.
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