In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone. - Social Anxiety Forum
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Wouldn't it be best if everyone in college and university to take an Abnormal Psychology class since everyone is affected by crime, bouts of depression, anxiety, stress, etc. a Health Science class (it's already a requirement), a Nutrition class, a Holistic Health class for promoting other alternative means for health, an Interpersonal Communication class for skillful means of handing conflict and teaching how to become inter and intrapersonal Rogerian (humanistic psychologist Carl Rogers) in relationships, and a Personal growth class teaching an effective Jungian (psychoanalytic and transpersonal psychologist Carl Jung) shadow work and teach Progoff's journaling method in understanding archetype material (more Carl Jung), and different practical fitness and health classes. Wouldn't that be ideal for a comprehensive informative wellness?

I don't know why the US Department of Education and the US Department of Health and Human Services doesn't do that already. What is wrong with these "know it all" health officials, educators, and mental health clinicians.

Though when I look at everyone around me in my current lifestyle, on the media, tv shows, films, music, art, literature, news stories, I see the apparent contradiction to why the world is mad, ill, and sick.
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 01:12 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


yes and no. yes they would be good courses to take but not in college. they should be taught in high school because thats when kids start to get independent. another good class would be finance. a lot of the nutrition that they teach in school is so outdated (food pyramid). i dont know why they havent updated the stuff

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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 01:46 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


To answer your question, no, for a few reasons. First of all, I absolutely hate that mentality that some people have that when something is wrong in society (or perceived to be wrong) the proper solution is for the government to swoop in mandate something, or make some law, and everything will be better. It's been done to death and it doesn't work. I don't see how this will be any different.

Second of all, I don't think that taking a few classes on a subject is going to have the effect you think it will. Pretty much every college mandates English classes, college students still can't write. There is mandatory math as well, students still can't divide. In fact, I think that a lot of time the classes are the problem. People take a class or two on an issue and they think they know a lot about it, when in actuality, they don't know *****. We have enough people running around the world pretending to know everything, we don't need any more.

Third, I don't know how many college (or high school for that matter) classes you've been in, but professors tend to view the world in a very one sided way. This isn't such a big deal to me, but when one is trying to mold society a certain way, such one sidedness can be trouble.

Anyway, those are just my thoughts on the matter.

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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 02:23 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kikachuck
Third, I don't know how many college (or high school for that matter) classes you've been in, but professors tend to view the world in a very one sided way. This isn't such a big deal to me, but when one is trying to mold society a certain way, such one sidedness can be trouble.
kikachuk, it may clarify things if you gave us some examples of the world view you are referring to. Do you mean the leftist view of the world?
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 02:34 PM
 
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Wouldn't it be great if schools would stick to hard subjects and force the parents to learn how to raise their kids properly (like we used to)? No way.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 02:35 PM
 
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


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Originally Posted by free thinker
kikachuk, it may clarify things if you gave us some examples of the world view you are referring to. Do you mean the leftist view of the world?
The feminized ultra-liberal world view.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 02:52 PM
 
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Quote:
Second of all, I don't think that taking a few classes on a subject is going to have the effect you think it will. Pretty much every college mandates English classes, college students still can't write. There is mandatory math as well, students still can't divide. In fact, I think that a lot of time the classes are the problem. People take a class or two on an issue and they think they know a lot about it.
I very much agree. Most students find even the simplest of classes too difficult and tend to have this "pass and forget" attitude towards education. If they can't grasp the English language, I have a hard time believing they're going to fare any better with an esoteric subject like Jungian shadow work. Health and interpersonal communications are already required classes where I live, and neither did much of anything to set me on a course for better living. People have to want to learn about these subjects for such classes to have any meaningful impact; most students are still young and fit and, unfortunately, aren't looking to the future in terms of health. These classes therefore just become obstacles to overcome and forget and thus never have their intended impact.

The problem is that the "benefits" of living an unhealthy lifestyle are unconsciously seen as outweighing the negatives. The food that tastes the best, requires little to no effort to prepare, and is often the cheapest also happens to be the worst for your body. Many people cannot afford or can't be bothered (or don't have the time) to prepare the healthier stuff. They may try it for a while, but then they look at the 90-year-old who ate garbage, drank, and smoked for much of his life, they look at the surgeries and drugs that are able to counteract the effects of poor decisions and the advances being made in medicine, and they figure that life is short and chances are good that they'll still be able to live a fairly long life regardless of whether or not it's a healthy one.

I disagree with kikachuck on the point that government has no role in the solution, however. Unfortunately, the poorest people in this country are the ones who are hardest hit by the effects of this. When a mother working for less than subsistence pay goes to the grocery store and finds that the only food she can afford is the kind most likely to make she and her children obese, what can she do? If she has to work 3 jobs to stay afloat, when does she have the time to prepare a decent meal and instill the importance of healthy living in her children? When her children go to school and find the same garbage being served in the cafeteria and in vending machines, what can she do? When she and her children eventually do become sick from all of the poison they've been ingesting and she can't afford to pay for those surgeries and drugs, what can she do? Healthy living is one of those things better learned by example than by rote in the classroom, and as in virtually every other aspect of life, those on the lower rungs of the socioeconomic ladder are at the greatest disadvantage and have the lowest chance of seeing improvement before it's too late.
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 05:18 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


[quote=Lyric Suite]
Quote:
Originally Posted by "free thinker":3a39f23e
kikachuk, it may clarify things if you gave us some examples of the world view you are referring to. Do you mean the leftist view of the world?
The feminized ultra-liberal world view.[/quote:3a39f23e]

Well, I wouldn't put it quite as harshly as that, but yeah. But let me say that I would have the same problem if an institution from another perspective, say the Catholic Church, had that much free reign over how to shape society too.

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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 07:11 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


I think they should in high school. Or at least have a class on how to deal in the real world.

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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 07:52 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kikachuck
...I absolutely hate that mentality that some people have that when something is wrong in society (or perceived to be wrong) the proper solution is for the government to swoop in mandate something, or make some law, and everything will be better. It's been done to death and it doesn't work.
So well said that I simply had to ditto it more than just once.
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-23-2008, 07:55 PM
 
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


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Originally Posted by Classified
I think they should in high school. Or at least have a class on how to deal in the real world.
Ooooh, put me in charge. I'll give those kids a taste of the real world.
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 09:54 AM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


[quote=kikachuck]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyric Suite
Quote:
Originally Posted by "free thinker":26srsd86
kikachuk, it may clarify things if you gave us some examples of the world view you are referring to. Do you mean the leftist view of the world?
The feminized ultra-liberal world view.
Well, I wouldn't put it quite as harshly as that, but yeah. But let me say that I would have the same problem if an institution from another perspective, say the Catholic Church, had that much free reign over how to shape society too.[/quote:26srsd86]
I'm still interested in getting some examples from you of how these professors have demonstrated their worldview to you. To me, Hollywood has shaped society far more than the university professors ever could.
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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 10:02 AM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


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I'm still interested in getting some examples from you of how these professors have demonstrated their worldview to you. To me, Hollywood has shaped society far more than the university professors ever could.
Oh, I totally agree. As it is right now, university professors don't really hold that much sway in society, but that was really my point. IF these sorts of classes are made mandatory in college, then they would have more sway than they do now.

But I must admit, I'm a tad confused by your insistence of examples of left wingery in college. Are you trying to dispute the fact the university is dominated by lefties? That's pretty obvious to anybody that's set foot on a college campus (minus a few of the BYU, bible college types). I hope you aren't under the impression that I'm trying to make some broad point about how there needs to be more right wing thinking on colleges, I'm not, frankly, I don't care. That's just the way it is, but I don't think that sort of thing should dominate and shape society.

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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 11:25 AM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kikachuck
As it is right now, university professors don't really hold that much sway in society, but that was really my point. IF these sorts of classes are made mandatory in college, then they would have more sway than they do now.
What mandatory classes are you referring to? Now, I think we should get back to your original quote(the one I had the question about).

Quote:
I don't know how many college (or high school for that matter) classes you've been in, but professors tend to view the world in a very one sided way. This isn't such a big deal to me, but when one is trying to mold society a certain way, such one sidedness can be trouble.
So, in the form of examples, how are the professors (in these classes you referred to) presenting this world view to you in such a one-sided manner?

Quote:
But I must admit, I'm a tad confused by your insistence of examples of left wingery in college. Are you trying to dispute the fact the university is dominated by lefties? That's pretty obvious to anybody that's set foot on a college campus (minus a few of the BYU, bible college types). I hope you aren't under the impression that I'm trying to make some broad point about how there needs to be more right wing thinking on colleges, I'm not, frankly, I don't care. That's just the way it is, but I don't think that sort of thing should dominate and shape society.
I'm not saying universities aren't dominated by left-wing professors, I just want to see some examples from you of how these professors are molding their students into left-wing thinking. Based on your examples of BYU and bible college schools(which shouldn't be considered left or right), is this really an issue for you about secular schools which don't present a Biblical worldview?
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 12:48 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


I pretty much agree with everything kikachuck said. We don't need more mandatory classes. You don't really learn or remember much of what's in those.

Adding a few random classes especially psychology could also cause problems. When people start getting into psychology they tend to start diagnosing themselves and others with all sorts of disorders. I saw some of it just from the 1 very short very basic psychology class we had in highschool. If you try you can find a mental disorder that matches every person on the planet. The definitions and tests for such things are far too vague. We don't need highschool students worrying that they or everyone else has some illness that needs treated instead of just being normal human beings with faults and individual personalities.

Nutrition can be a controversial subject as well. I took some animal nutrition classes in college and I'd have to say after doing my own research I disagree with well over half of it. Nutrition is a very poorly researched and understood subject. Even vets and doctors aren't the greatest people to discuss nutrition with. I would only take nutritional advice from an actual nutritionist and then I'd still double check online to see if majority of the sources out there agree. I don't think a nutrition class is going to help anyway. Just cause I know certain foods are healthier doesn't mean I eat them. Eating healthy is something kids have to be taught growing up.

As for a real life class. It's not something you can teach in one class. Instead the entire highschool setup needs to be redone. You can't control the students and give them no freedoms and expect them to be ready for the real world. The strictest parents often end up with the kids that do the worst in college and go out partying alot or get into some things they shouldn't like drugs. They've never been allowed to make mistakes and learn from them when the mistakes were small. Now they are dealing with major choices and the only consequences they know are getting punished by their parents or those that run the school. Well those people aren't there as much in college so the students don't realize there are any consequences. People spend too much time worrying about kids messing up their lives in highschool and so watching over them too much and not allowing them to learn self control and how to manage themselves when noone is looking over their shoulder.

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post #16 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 01:02 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


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What mandatory classes are you referring to? Now, I think we should get back to your original quote(the one I had the question about).
Um, the mandatory classes that the OP implied were needed?

Quote:
So, in the form of examples, how are the professors (in these classes you referred to) presenting this world view to you in such a one-sided manner?
Well, if you insist, I'll give a few from my own college experience. I had a class, a philosophy class, where essentially every test question was some slur against the Bush administration. Think what you will, but it was a philosophy class and they had nothing to do with the subject matter.

Also, in a government class, we had to spend two class periods with representatives from both the state NM democratic party and the head of the campus democrats. But shockingly, we "ran out of time" and couldn't have any meeting with the republicans.

Subtle, but stuff like that is important when you want to mold the minds of impressionable youths.

Quote:
I'm not saying universities aren't dominated by left-wing professors, I just want to see some examples from you of how these professors are molding their students into left-wing thinking. Based on your examples of BYU and bible college schools(which shouldn't be considered left or right), is this really an issue for you about secular schools which don't present a Biblical worldview?
Those were meant as schools that aren't dominated by lefties, don't be so pedantic. You are using minutia to try and trip me up, but my point is that it's not a good idea to let any institution have so much control over the shaping of society.

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post #17 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


I said informed. That doesn't necessarily mean you have to agree with it or not, understand it or not, or practice it or not. The point is that you are informed of all theories, all various options and all application of those theories and options for the gain that one day or not you may choose to pursue more curiosity in the information or the activity module if you want. For example, if a crime happened in your neighborhood and you wanted to understand what that was about. Or another example, if you had a relationship problem and wanted to understand why did the conflict happened. Or yet even another example, if you had cancer and wasn't really benefiting from Orthodox advice and wanted to try if an Eastern or an Alternative approach hoping it might suit you better or aid and complement with the Orthodox advice. So what I mean is that there's the potential that you might even consider the information that was learned, or if some of you think passed by your head (forgotten or not learned) in such courses that the information might be of valuable use later in life. If everyone was at least inform of all options and theories and were given the understanding of complications and validity in such approaches (as another poster had concerns about) they will know how to potentially take action, understand one's symptoms (mentally, emotionally, and somatically (sp?)) and/or also understand societal phenomenon better, and also use that information for others such as family and friends if they are in need, affected, or troubled.

As another person mention of extension of such application elsewhere, this course structure ideally can go beyond college/university in high schools, clinics, hospitals, community centers, government agencies, more authentic talk shows, political analysis, and fitness and health shows on television, promoting videos, audio CDs, classes, workshops, awareness events, etc.

I believe human beings fundamental nature are to be healthy actualized beings following whatever their unique bliss is (there own personal meaning in the world, their Jungian archetypes), global world concerned citizens, physically healthy and fit, caring, supporting, understanding and all the like in relationships, yet the problem is so obvious people are primarily Pavlovian classically conditioning responses to Hollywood entertainment (like someone said), Corporate backwashing, etc. in promoting destructive behaviors, and think naive, ignorant and less educated less informed options in pursuing ideals in self and society, plus being fixated and stuck at certain developmental stages whatever scheme that is out there (Freud, Loevinger, Erikson, Maslow, Gilligan, Graves, Mahler, etc.) where psychopathology begins and finding the hard way out through the lens of one's own experience and through relationships whether healthy or unhealthy leading them to freedom and understanding from suffering or most likely not like the finally pursuance of individual therapy which are all options that don't necessarily inform the individual at the start of the potential prevention. Can everyone understand now that comprehensive informative wellness is strongly needed in society on all levels of infrastructure? Or unless you agree with the conflicts, tensions, disease, and suffering the world is in. All you need to do is the injunction of turning on the television right now and get a taste of society that is less and not informed.
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post #18 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 03:19 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kikachuck
Well, if you insist, I'll give a few from my own college experience. I had a class, a philosophy class, where essentially every test question was some slur against the Bush administration.
I only had one college class where the professor (and his teaching assistant) showed the most blatant bias. It was a sociology class called "Social Problems" and we were basically taught that white males, especially the rich ones, were at the root of every social problem.

I guess this professor was either very self-loathing or had failed to look in a mirror to discover that he was a white male! A white male who complained about segregation in places like Milwaukee and then after class drove off to his suburban home in Whitefish Bay, that could just as well be called White Folks Bay, given their almost 100% white population. I'm not impressed by a hypocrite who whines about segregation and then perpetuates it by choosing to live in as white a place as one can find within Milwaukee County.

Not all professors are biased. I had a philosophy professor who taught an ethics class and he never gave the slighted hint of which views he agreed with or which ones he though were nonsense. The final exam was an essay and he said he'd prefer a well-argued essay that he fully disagrees with than a poorly-written argument for a view he holds.

I was a business major and there tends not to be a liberal bias in that area. After all, it's unlikely a commie is going to get a PhD and teach investment finance when he thinks everything should be state owned, thus getting rid of stock markets and investing. Being a finance professor and not believing in free markets is a bit like being a priest who doesn't believe in god.
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post #19 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 04:17 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


I'm not especially prone to fear government intervention in education, but I don't see much applicability here. The information you suggested be, if I read correctly, a required part of some school cirriculum is available lots of other places. It seems uneccessary.
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post #20 of 27 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 06:19 PM
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Re: In promoting ideal health and wellness for everyone.


I, for one, was busy enough with the classes for my major in university, let alone being forced to take a ton of totally unrelated and totally irrelevant classes like that.

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