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Old 12-12-2010, 04:20 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default Perika, or other high-quality SJW formulations--experiences?

Yesterday, I started taking Perika (WS 5570), a high-quality SJW formulation by Nature's Way. Supposedly, this is the best formulation (maybe along with Kira), because it contains a standardized extract with large amounts of hyperforin, the main active ingredient in SJW and a monoamine reuptake inhibitor of serotonin, norepinephrine, dopamine, GABA, and and glutamate. It seems to have a slightly different mechanism of action than SSRIs, and clinical trials have confirmed it has higher efficacy, a much lower side effect profile, and a higher rate of remission than Paxil! Only a tricyclic antidepressant outperformed it in one study, and not significantly.

Paxil vs. WS 5570 comparison in one study for moderate to severe depression: http://www.bmj.com/content/330/7490/503.abstract

Has anyone tried Perika--or any other high-quality SJW formulation like SC27, Kira, or HBC Protocols, not any old formulation (very important)--with good results? Furthermore, did you supplement with anything else at the time? I'm particularly interested in the efficacy of SJW for atypical depression, which I suspect most of us social phobics with depression have (increased sleeping, sometimes increased appetite with carb/sweet cravings, very low energy/motivation, worsening at night, etc.).

Before anyone says this should be in the supplement section, SJW is a prescription drug in many (most?) countries and as it has similar efficacy to American prescription drugs like Paxil, I believe it should stay in this section, if only so it's taken more seriously.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
 
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For light to moderate depression, its not bad...it sucks for SA.
I`ve never heard of someone having success with SJW for SA.
Altough it can even work for severe depression(in Germany, there are some good studies on it).....but for light to moderate depression ...why not?

btw, SJW is a prescription drug in many (most) countries? Source?
AFAIK.....you can get it free in Europe for example....except Ireland.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Btw, my experience is based on the brand Jarsin.
Most of the SJW-studies in Germany are based on Jarsin.
However, I don`t know if Perica or Kira are as good as Jarsin...or even better.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leon21 View Post
For light to moderate depression, its not bad...it sucks for SA.
I`ve never heard of someone having success with SJW for SA.
Altough it can even work for severe depression(in Germany, there are some good studies on it).....but for light to moderate depression ...why not?

btw, SJW is a prescription drug in many (most) countries? Source?
AFAIK.....you can get it free in Europe for example....except Ireland.
I'm more concerned with depression at this point in time, but it's good to have a data point regarding social anxiety.

My theory is that SJW might be more effective than SSRIs (but less so than prescription MAOIs like Nardil, Parnate, or selegiline) in the treatment of atypical depression, because it seems to share equal affinity for the serotonin, dopamine, and noradrenaline receptors, versus the obvious serotonin selectivity of the SSRIs.

My depression is moderate to severe (which may be exacerbated by situational factors), particularly at night.

I was under the impression it was a prescription drug in Germany, for example, where it's been most studied recently. I can't find where I read this, but I believe it was prescribed 50% of the time for major depression, versus 2% for sertraline. Perhaps I'm wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leon21 View Post
Btw, my experience is based on the brand Jarsin.
Most of the SJW-studies in Germany are based on Jarsin.
However, I don`t know if Perica or Kira are as good as Jarsin...or even better.
Perika--WS 5570--is sold under a different name in Germany by Schwabe Pharmaceuticals, which created the formulation originally--Neuroplant, perhaps. I'm not sure what Jarsin is; I could only find one study using it, versus numerous for the WS 5570 formulation.
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Old 12-12-2010, 06:37 PM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Perika=Neuroplant?.... I would go with Perika....it`s (Neuroplant) even slightly better then Jarsin.(ratio of hyperforin)........ (There are also many studies with Neuroplant).

You can get (good) SJW prescription-free in any german pharmacy.
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Old 12-12-2010, 06:53 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leon21 View Post
Perika=Neuroplant?.... I would go with Perika....it`s (Neuroplant) even slightly better then Jarsin.(ratio of hyperforin)........ (There are also many studies with Neuroplant).

You can get (good) SJW prescription-free in any german pharmacy.
Yep, I'm on Perika now. I seem to already notice a slight mood lift, but I'm also on 500mg L-Tyrosine, so it's hard to tell which is working. I'm desperate for some measure of relief, but I know combining two substances at first is very unscientific.

Huh. Good to know about SJW being prescription-free. Maybe that was a recent thing? Because I know I read somewhere that docs in Germany prescribed it. Maybe they just meant they prescribed it as in telling the patient to go buy it.
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Old 12-13-2010, 09:24 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Bump. Any others with SJW experiences?

I'm on my third day of SJW, although I was inconsistent with dosing today--ended up taking one pill at lunch and two at dinnertime. I got a nasty headache after the second dose and ibuprofen helped a little. I'm hoping these headaches fade.

As far as effects on mood--this will be my journal, I suppose; if it helps, I'd like others to benefit from my experience--I think it helped a little more today. Keep in mind, I'm also taking 500mg of l-tyrosine with the first dose. I've read some sites that say not to combine the two, but others said it's fine--so I'm doing it. No signs of serotonin syndrome or anything yet, and I suspect the mechanism of action of SJW is so different from SSRIs that they won't interact. Didn't take my bp today but I assume it's fine.

So, yeah, about my mood: I felt a little more energy and motivation during the day, which can probably be explained by slightly increased dopamine (simplistic, yes) function. Anergy has been up there as far as the worst of my depressive symptoms. I actually left the house and ran some errands and went to a restaurant/cafe and stayed for a few hours, eating and using my laptop. I almost (almost) wanted to do these things, but I still had to force myself. At night, perhaps due to the lack of dosing during the day (but likely just because SJW usually takes a long time to work, similar to SSRIs), I felt only marginally better, if at all, than the past two nights. I felt really bad after the headache and became worried I would become or was becoming hypomanic (thanks, OCD).

Will update as often as I remember. Comments and other experiences much appreciated!
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Old 12-13-2010, 09:31 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
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I tried both standard St Johns Wort and Perika.

Unfortunately St Johns Wort gives me a massive migraine headache everytime I try it. I've tried it three seperate times and i only last a week because the headache is too much.

Wish you luck with it tho!!!!!
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Old 12-13-2010, 10:14 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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I tried both standard St Johns Wort and Perika.

Unfortunately St Johns Wort gives me a massive migraine headache everytime I try it. I've tried it three seperate times and i only last a week because the headache is too much.

Wish you luck with it tho!!!!!
Yep, per my post, I got a headache, too. But I'm hoping it dissipates as I continue taking SJW. It wasn't a migraine, but it wasn't fun. Ibuprofen took care of it. How would I know if it's a developing migraine? I've never had one.

Thanks!
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Old 12-17-2010, 10:26 AM   #10 (permalink)
 
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Update!

Headache no longer occurs after taking SJW.

However, I'm not sure my depression is much better. I still feel very anhedonic and anergic, and slept over 10 hours last night. I'm on vacation, so that's more excusable, but I can still sense the propensity for endless sleep as a result of the depression.

It's only been 6 days, though, and I'm going to give it at least 3 weeks to have an effect.
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Old 07-18-2012, 11:59 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwfan07 View Post
Update!

Headache no longer occurs after taking SJW.

However, I'm not sure my depression is much better. I still feel very anhedonic and anergic, and slept over 10 hours last night. I'm on vacation, so that's more excusable, but I can still sense the propensity for endless sleep as a result of the depression.

It's only been 6 days, though, and I'm going to give it at least 3 weeks to have an effect.
What ever came of this? Did it end up working out?
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