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Old 08-19-2009, 05:45 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default Antidepressants with stimulant like qualities?

Ok so i am wondering what types of antidepressants out there have qualities similar to stimulants. I am currently taking welbutrin, adderal, and klonopin. It has been a good mix but i know that i will build up a tolerance and will need something else so was just curious if anyone knew? Thanks
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Old 08-19-2009, 05:57 PM   #2 (permalink)
 
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problem is an AD that stimulates one may well sedate another, its so variable

if the well is helping then maybe cut back on the klon
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Old 08-19-2009, 07:59 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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There are some traditional antidepressants known for their stimulating effects - Wellbutrin, Effexor, Pristiq, Strattera (though, that's mainly only used for treating AD/HD). These are the ones I can think of that are available in the US. In some other countries, there are probably other stimulating antidepressants than those listed here.

Also, actual stimulants themselves are antidepressants, but their use as this is controversial. Ritalin is a NDRI similar to Wellbutrin, but Ritalin also does some other things that give it abuse potential, so it's not commonly used as an antidepressant (though, it was originally marketed as one). Adderall and Dexedrine are both very uplifting and energizing, but the same controversy exists over their use in depression - you will have to have a very open minded doctor and a list of drugs you have tried and failed in the past if you expect to get a script for any of these actual psychostimulants.

And then there's the MAOIs like Parnate and Eldepryl. Both of them are antidepressants that metabolize into amphetamines in the body, so they both have marked stimulating effects, but they tend to come with some dietary and drug restrictions that might make them unfavorable to some.
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Old 08-19-2009, 10:40 PM   #4 (permalink)
 
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And then there's the MAOIs like Parnate and Eldepryl. Both of them are antidepressants that metabolize into amphetamines in the body, so they both have marked stimulating effects, but they tend to come with some dietary and drug restrictions that might make them unfavorable to some.
MAOI's metabolize into amphetamines? I have never heard that. Through a different mechanism, it raises the amount of dopamine and norepinephrine, but I don't think any actual amphetamine-like compounds are added or involved.
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Old 08-20-2009, 12:15 AM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Also, actual stimulants themselves are antidepressants, but their use as this is controversial. Ritalin is a NDRI similar to Wellbutrin, but Ritalin also does some other things that give it abuse potential, so it's not commonly used as an antidepressant (though, it was originally marketed as one). Adderall and Dexedrine are both very uplifting and energizing, but the same controversy exists over their use in depression - you will have to have a very open minded doctor and a list of drugs you have tried and failed in the past if you expect to get a script for any of these actual psychostimulants.
Wellbutrin only binds to approx 22-26 percent of the dopamine transporter sites.
However it's been shown that dopamine transporter-blocking drugs must induce >50% dopamine transporter blockade and the blockade must be timely (within 15
minutes) to produce reinforcing effects. For this reason I assume more conservative doctors would favour wellbutrin over ritalin.

As far as antidepressants that can have "activiating" effects; Prozac, Effexor XR, Pristiq, and Cymbalta in addition to Wellbutrin would probly be your best bet.
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Old 08-20-2009, 02:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by bheslop View Post
Ok so i am wondering what types of antidepressants out there have qualities similar to stimulants. I am currently taking welbutrin, adderal, and klonopin. It has been a good mix but i know that i will build up a tolerance and will need something else so was just curious if anyone knew? Thanks
NMDA antagonists should help to keep tolerance down. The easiest option would be the supplement Magnesium Glycinate. Others include prescription drugs like Memantine, Caroverine, Amantadine and Acamprosate.

Adderall + Klonopin (+ Bupropion) is a potent cocktail for social phobia. Activating antidepressants will most likely not be as effective (except maybe irreversible MAOIs like Nardil and Parnate) and some can SA even worse.
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Old 08-20-2009, 11:29 AM   #7 (permalink)
 
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NMDA antagonists should help to keep tolerance down. The easiest option would be the supplement Magnesium Glycinate. Others include prescription drugs like Memantine, Caroverine, Amantadine and Acamprosate.

Adderall + Klonopin (+ Bupropion) is a potent cocktail for social phobia. Activating antidepressants will most likely not be as effective (except maybe irreversible MAOIs like Nardil and Parnate) and some can SA even worse.
I have been hearing a lot about Magnesium Glycinate and im sure this is asked a lot but how much should i take? And should i take it with the adderrall or at night? Yea i really like the combo i am on now and would love to keep it, but the tolerance is what i fear.
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Old 08-20-2009, 11:46 AM   #8 (permalink)
 
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I find magnesium makes me more anxious, heck is that even possible? I bought some decent quality chelated magnesium and that just made me way too aggitated, edgy and anxious.
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Old 08-20-2009, 10:21 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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I find magnesium makes me more anxious, heck is that even possible? I bought some decent quality chelated magnesium and that just made me way too aggitated, edgy and anxious.
i get that reaction from the calcium supplements, the magnesium was really good the first few times (felt a lot like neurontin) but after a while just too sedating for me. maybe you'd get the opposite result from calcium supplements, but if u take too much you might f up your kidneys or just have to pee all the time.

one thing i haven't heard brought up in any of the discussions about stims is modafinil. it's quite interesting but hard to really tell where in the brain it's doing its work and what the mechanism exactly is, but it is usually a little stronger than wellbutrin and less likely to cause the same edginess for me
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Old 08-21-2009, 09:01 PM   #10 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by bheslop View Post
Ok so i am wondering what types of antidepressants out there have qualities similar to stimulants. I am currently taking welbutrin, adderal, and klonopin. It has been a good mix but i know that i will build up a tolerance and will need something else so was just curious if anyone knew? Thanks
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Old 03-11-2010, 08:02 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medline View Post
NMDA antagonists should help to keep tolerance down. The easiest option would be the supplement Magnesium Glycinate. Others include prescription drugs like Memantine, Caroverine, Amantadine and Acamprosate.

Adderall + Klonopin (+ Bupropion) is a potent cocktail for social phobia. Activating antidepressants will most likely not be as effective (except maybe irreversible MAOIs like Nardil and Parnate) and some can SA even worse.
so magnesium glycinate would have similar effect to memantine? is memantine and amantadine similar to neurontin and topamax?
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Old 03-11-2010, 08:27 AM   #12 (permalink)
 
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so magnesium glycinate would have similar effect to memantine? is memantine and amantadine similar to neurontin and topamax?
No, magnesium wont be as good as memantine, neurontin and topamax have a differend mechanism of action the memantine.
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Old 03-11-2010, 08:43 AM   #13 (permalink)
 
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I am taking a herbal product called GNC: STAT Get Focused.

$15.00 for 7 packs in US
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Old 03-11-2010, 05:52 PM   #14 (permalink)
 
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Are you looking for a 24/7 treatment that shares many of amphetamine's wonderful effects? Nothing out there at the moment. Take the bupropion everyday, and use Adderall 3-4 days per week as needed. With each Adderall dose, take 200mg of magnesium glycinate simultaneously.
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Old 03-14-2010, 03:46 PM   #15 (permalink)
 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kratom
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:13 PM   #16 (permalink)
 
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With each Adderall dose, take 200mg of magnesium glycinate simultaneously.
Where would I find that specific form of magnesium? I took a quick look and find there are a ton of magnesium supplements out there. I find magnesium...citrate, oxide, asperate, chloride. Can you provide a link to one that contains magnesium glycinate as you suggest?

I'd be interested in giving it a try.

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Old 03-15-2010, 04:24 AM   #17 (permalink)
 
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ultrashy the vitamin shoppe (google vitamin shoppe near yourzipcode) has magnesium taurate. i popped a couple before bed last night and it was quite nice and relaxing. gonna try 400mg today and see what i notice.
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Old 04-25-2010, 07:03 AM   #18 (permalink)
 
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ultrashy the vitamin shoppe (google vitamin shoppe near yourzipcode) has magnesium taurate. i popped a couple before bed last night and it was quite nice and relaxing. gonna try 400mg today and see what i notice.
I was just there yesterday and saw they had magnesium glycinate exactly as IllusionalFate recommended, along with every other supplement under the sun. I should have bought a bottle, but I'm the Lord of Indecision. It was only $12 for 90 tablets (a bit cheaper per pill in a larger bottle). I might buy some today, since I may be out that way again.

I guess it's worth a try.
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Old 04-25-2010, 07:20 AM   #19 (permalink)
 
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Protriptilyne (a Tricyclic) or Parnate (MAOI)

They just don't get more stimulating than that.
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Old 01-01-2011, 11:09 AM   #20 (permalink)
 
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I have just added a Kratom Faq to the blog section for you, but don't know how to link to it (try this one)

Kratom can indeed have both stimulant and anti depressant qualities combined, but it does matter a bit what strain you take. This is for example true with Green Malay or Sumatra White (also offered as Super (green) Indo etc) but less for the Borneo and Bali types of kratom powder. Familiarize yourself with kratom side effects, risk for addiction and co-administration with other medicines (see blog mentioned) before taking.

Check this for more detailed info, effects/duration etc on the various Indo kratom powder
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