Nac working for OCD

[crayzyMed]

Originally Posted by jer

Hi, you guys taking NAC, I would like to give it a try. My OCD is severe.

I would appreciate if you could tell me the brands are you taking and where do you get them.
Is there a recommended "best" brand that I need to look for.

I just got it from my local pharmacy, some generic brand (i'm from belguim), its very cheap and they should have it in every pharmacy.
Just ask for acetylcysteine.

[jer]

thanks for the quick reply. I am going shopping in a moment. I will ask for that.

[soto]

Hi jer - you should be able to buy NAC in bulk, I live in australia so have ordered it online through these guys http://www.mfcd.net/depot/prodamino.asp, but you should be able to find a local supplier.

I have just started taking it in the last few days, I am waiting to borrow some electronic scales off a mate so I am only roughly measuring out my daily dose at the moment, I have read NAC weights 3.7g per metric teaspoon so I am taking about 1/8 teaspoon twice daily to make up a 1 gram/day dose until the scales arrive.

It is too early to really tell what it is doing OCD wise, but I have felt a bit 'flattened' or dulled the last couple of days which could be due to the NAC. I will let you know how I go, I will trial it for a couple of months and see what effect it has.

[odspot]

Originally Posted by soto

It is too early to really tell what it is doing OCD wise, but I have felt a bit 'flattened' or dulled the last couple of days which could be due to the NAC.

same, though Parnate also kinda does that to me. i'm tapering off Parnate now so will know for sure what effect the NAC has. i'm thinking of going up to 1.8g (from 1.2), but wonder how much glutamate regulation is a good thing. it's actually almost impossible to find any first-person NAC reports on the 'net (for OCD anyway), so we should all keep updating this thread.

[odspot]

do you notice any dullness/fogginess crazymed?

[crayzyMed]

I've never noticed any foggyness.

[odspot]

so you're still on 1.8g? coming off right now Parnate is hell, and making my OCD 1000x worse. i may raise the NAC dose to see if i can ease that a bit.

[crayzyMed]

Originally Posted by odspot

so you're still on 1.8g? coming off right now Parnate is hell, and making my OCD 1000x worse. i may raise the NAC dose to see if i can ease that a bit.

No i stopped taking nac, it still worked but i got other things to experiment with now.

[soto]

Hi odspot - so far so good, almost 1 week now - i got the digital scales and worked out i've been on about 600mg/day - I will double this at the end of the week.

yeah I have noticed a bit of a foggy feeling - which makes sense like turning the dimmer switch down - afterall glutamate is the brain's major excitatory neurotransmitter, but I usually don't take side effects that seriously for the first week or two, need a couple of weeks to get an accurate picture once the body/mind has adjusted to it.

I believe it has had a slight positive effect on reducing my OCD symptoms, I am ruminating less during the day, and less intrusive images/thoughts, they have lost their 'punch' a bit. I look forward to take the dose up, looks promising..

PS I recommend taking a good B Complex vitamin with it, esp B12 for clearing homocysteine.

[jer]

thanks Soto and Crazymeds.

after my last post, I went directly to Walmart and checked out the supplement section.
I couldnt find any NAC. there were a ton of other supplements - a wall filled with stuff.

anyway I will try other supermarkets here and see if I can find NAC.

[Vini Vidi Vici]

if you find it could you post where? the only place i could think of was GNC, and usually that is expensive

[crayzyMed]

Originally Posted by jer

thanks Soto and Crazymeds.

after my last post, I went directly to Walmart and checked out the supplement section.
I couldnt find any NAC. there were a ton of other supplements - a wall filled with stuff.

anyway I will try other supermarkets here and see if I can find NAC.

I think you better go to a pharmacy and ask for "acetylcysteine" nog NAC because they wont know that name. Was my experience. Its not solled as a supplyment in places like wallmarkt, you need to go to a pharmacy.

[odspot]

i am definitely still noticing an increase in fogginess. i'm not convinced this side-effect will pass either (it didn't on Memantine), given that the glutamate modulation is a primary effect... unless it's some kind of detoxification reaction? i don't believe it's placebo either, as i popped a pill halfway through reading a theory chapter and suddenly experienced a lot more difficulty absorbing information. on the plus side, i also felt a lot calmer.

i read that NAC only has a half-life of 1.5 hours or so. i'm wondering if it might be better to take smaller doses - 2-300mg three times a day, rather than 600mg all at once. Jarrow's also make a sustained-release formula which sounds worth looking into.

[crayzyMed]

I used to take 600mg 3 times a day.

[soto]

odspot - I don't think the half life of NAC is the issue, it is absorbed rapidly and converted to cysteine, which in turn is used as a precursor for glutathione - current understanding is that the increase in cysteine levels is what normalizes glutamate levels in the brain (not the NAC itself).

I've been taking 600mg morning and night for the past 3 days - the best way I can describe the effect is that it reduces the intensity of the obsessions - one of my obsessions was quite badly triggered yesterday, and I still spent the rest of the day ruminating about it, but the intensity of the distress was managable instead of overwhelming.

My understanding of NAC so far is that it flattens the spikes from OCD, and more succesfully keeps distrubing thoughts 'below the surface' - but it is NOT an antidepressant, if anything I have found that my mood is flattened a bit since taking it, I have heard that NAC is also being trialled for bipolar disorder, and this makes alot of sense, it steers you away from the manic end of the spectrum.

In comparison to Inositol, I have found NAC a more effective anti-obsessional (although I still use both, with the Inositol >10g/day being a good antidepressant) , I think it is well worth trying for anyone with OCD

[odspot]

thanks for the explanation soto. i shouldn't be so quick to indulge in amateur science i also find your description of NAC's benefits re: OCD accurate - the thoughts seem to remain lingering in the back of my mind, but they lack their usual potency or draw. in fact, i barely seem to get any real 'spikes' at all.

of course, natural agents should probably be used in synergy, and i get how NAC wouldn't work as a standalone compound. now that i am just about finished with Parnate (waiting for the 2-week washout to end), i am thinking about my next step, AD-wise. i have long considered giving inositol a decent trial as an anti-anxiety/panic/mood-brightening agent. i have also had some wonderful results with SAM-e when i tried it briefly before Parnate.

do you take inositol in conjunction with meds, soto, or do you feel that high doses are a suitable SSRI equivalent?

my pdoc really wants me to try anafranil, but it sounds fairly gruesome, side-effect-wise. i feel like i owe it to myself to at least give inositol a fair try before i move onto another med.

[soto]

hey odspot - good to discuss this with someone else going through the same experiences - I need to point out that I have not been diagnosed with SAD, I came to this forum specifically becuase of the discussion of OCD meds, which alot of people here also seem to suffer with. So I am not very familiar with meds for ADs other than OCD.

In relation to Anafranil, I did trial it when I first got diagnosed with OCD - it appears that many of the 'old school' psychs dish it out as a first-port-of-call. That being said, there is strong research to show that it is a very good anti-obsessional (perhaps the best). Personally I couldn't hack it, I litterally lasted less than a week - I felt considerably out of it at work and experienced total impotence. Perhaps if I had given it a go for longer the side effects would have diminished. I don't want to put you off, because it is probably worth trying if your OCD is really debilitating - however, I found it to be a traumatic experience and subsequently got a referal to another psych afterwards.

Talk it over with your doctor, but if you want to go down this path I understand that SSRIs are equally as effective in many cases, incase you haven't tried some already.

The reason I have explored alternative supplements is because I can't tolerate the sexual side effects of SSRIs - my OCD is a pain in the *** to deal with, but it would have to be unbearable before I considered giving up my sex life to go on treatment.

I'm not the best person to ask about SSRIs becuase I've never used any other than the anafranil trial. I will say I have noticed a big difference in my mood since using Inositol - which I have used at 12g/day for several months now, but you would be best to talk to someone who has used both in order to get a good comparison. I think Inositol is a very underated substance, but better as an antidepressant than as an anti-obsessional. I also have alot less arguments with my girlfriend since using Inositol, I don't get as stressed out over little things like I used to, I am more chilled out.

Good luck, keep me posted how you go with the NAC.

[odspot]

i do not have SAD either, though i have developed some avoidance issues in my depression.

i sort of suffer from a catch-22. i've tried a couple of SSRI's, but always came off them quickly because i could not tolerate the side-effects (especially the brain-fog, which interfered with my professional life). i had a stressful experience on Remeron (it turned the volume up on my OCD x1000) and cold-turkeyed off the drug, but was left with a lot of executive dysfunction issues afterward. i had to stop working because i couldn't really think straight; psychs told me it was a depression, but it didn't feel like it. i tried a couple more AD's to no real avail, and was finally put on Nardil, which relieved the depression (by that point i had become genuinely depressed due to not working), but didn't do an awful lot for my cognition, so i tapered off it. Parnate on the other hand helped cognition but made me too aggressive to function, and brought back the OCD full-force.

that's been the past year. i'm still young, so am not rushing into my next decision. my OCD is bad, yes, but it strangely remits when i'm depressed because i lack the mental energy to carry through my obsessions. i don't think SSRI's alone are the answer; anything dopaminergic (tyrosine, Parnate, SAM-e etc.) brings me completely back to life, but then worsens the OCD/anxiety. so i think i need a more multi-purpose solution which takes my higher functioning into account. unfortunately, i can't really find a decent psychiatrist experienced in polypharmacy where i live, so am just holding off with CBT for now. my family's moving to another country soon where my uncle holds a high position in a hospital, so hopefully i can find better treatment. until then, i was just gonna experiment with natural stuff for the hell of it. i spoke to one guy who said he quit 17 years of therapy because inositol was so effective, but he takes it in conjunction with an SSRI. still, he said it's not the SSRI alone - he could not live without the inositol. i guess since it sensitizes serotonin receptors, maybe it is more useful with another serotonergic agent, which is why i wanted to include SAM-e. i think anafranil would be a last-ditch solution if i was ever hospitalized or anything.

sorry for the long post.

[jer]

Originally Posted by Vini Vidi Vici

if you find it could you post where? the only place i could think of was GNC, and usually that is expensive

I got it from HEB yesterday. Here in Texas, HEB is a big supermarket like walmart.

they had 2 kinds - brand ($15) and generic(11). I bought the generic one.
lets see how it goes.

[jer]

I read on the internet that whey protein has the same effect as NAC supplements, since they both act on the glutathione .

is that true?

if so, I should have tried whey protein before buying the supplement.